THE ACQUITTAL OF CARBON DIOXIDE
by Jeffrey A. Glassman, PhD
ABSTRACT
Carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is the product of oceanic respiration due to the well‑known but under‑appreciated solubility pump. Carbon dioxide rises out of warm ocean waters where it is added to the atmosphere. There it is mixed with residual and accidental CO2, and circulated, to be absorbed into the sink of the cold ocean waters. Next the thermohaline circulation carries the CO2‑rich sea water deep into the ocean. A millennium later it appears at the surface in warm waters, saturated by lower pressure and higher temperature, to be exhausted back into the atmosphere.
Throughout the past 420 millennia, comprising four interglacial periods, the Vostok record of atmospheric carbon dioxide concentration is imprinted with, and fully characterized by, the physics of the solubility of CO2 in water, along with the lag in the deep ocean circulation. Notwithstanding that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas, atmospheric carbon dioxide has neither caused nor amplified global temperature increases. Increased carbon dioxide has been an effect of global warming, not a cause. Technically, carbon dioxide is a lagging proxy for ocean temperatures. When global temperature, and along with it, ocean temperature rises, the physics of solubility causes atmospheric CO2 to increase. If increases in carbon dioxide, or any other greenhouse gas, could have in turn raised global temperatures, the positive feedback would have been catastrophic. While the conditions for such a catastrophe were present in the Vostok record from natural causes, the runaway event did not occur. Carbon dioxide does not accumulate in the atmosphere.
I. INTRODUCTION
Carbon dioxide, a benign gas, is now the hyper–volatile fuel of public policy, media hype, and world politics. Climatologists, undeterred by their inability to predict even the dominant features of the earth’s climate record – the ice ages and the glacial periods – have nonetheless scored a political coup by cobbling together three selected bits of science into a cataclysmic prediction: man is on the verge of destroying life on the planet.
The three cobblestones are (1) a smattering of greenhouse gas physics, (2) half a million years worth of data from Vostok ice cores and (3) half a century of data from Mauna Loa atmospheric CO2 monitoring. Presented here are new results from analysis of the second, the Vostok data, reductions which have a profound effect on the other two legs of the global warming stool, on the role of carbon dioxide, and ultimately on public policy.
{Rev. 6/29/08.} The IPCC said,
One family of hypotheses to explain glacial/inter-glacial variations of atmospheric CO2 relies on physical mechanisms that could change the dissolution and outgassing of CO2 in the ocean. The solubility of CO2 is increased at low temperature, but reduced at high salinity. These effects nearly cancel out over the glacial/inter-glacial cycle, so simple solubility changes are not the answer.
IPCC, Third Assessment Report (TAR), Box 3.4, Causes of glacial/inter-glacial changes in atmospheric CO2, p. 202. Contrary to the IPCC conclusion, "changes in solubility" and second order effects of salinity are irrelevant. Changes in CO2 concentration due to classical temperature effects on solubility between ice age epochs account for the measured variations. These are intra-epoch effects, and whether they "nearly cancel out" on a larger scale is immaterial. {End Rev. 6/28/08.}
II. VOSTOK DATA
A. CLIMATOLOGISTS’ VIEW OF VOSTOK DATA
Climatologists show the Vostok ice core data of temperature and carbon dioxide graphically on a frequently reproduced and well‑known chart like that in Figure 1. These data reveal a compelling correlation between the concentration of CO2 and temperature.
An aside: Recently published, new ice core data extend the carbon dioxide trace back an additional 200,000 years. Figure 2. This extended record cannot contribute to this analysis until someone reduces and publishes corresponding temperature data.
The author of Figure 1 employs a bit of marginally acceptable, subjective chartsmanship to underscore a point. He selected scale factors and data ranges to emphasize the correlation between carbon dioxide and temperature. The peak to peak swings in the chart traces are arbitrarily made to look alike. This is subjective and artificial, but harmless here.
What is not harmless, though, is climatologists seizing on the lock-step rising and falling of temperature and carbon dioxide as evidence, if not proof, of their greenhouse gas theory: increased CO2 allegedly causes increased temperatures. (A tacit assumption is that the ice core temperature swings represent the global swings, an assumption adopted for this analysis, too.)
When other analysts examined the data, they found that the CO2 trace lagged the temperature curve by about a millennium. This confounds the greenhouse theory prediction. CO2 couldn’t be the cause of past global temperature increases!
The climatologists were quick with an offense and a defense. They labeled the discoverers of the lag as contrarians. And Carbon dioxide while not initiating the temperature rise surely amplified it:
CO2 changes parallel Antarctic temperature changes during deglaciations (citations). This is consistent with a significant contribution of these greenhouse gases to the glacial–interglacial changes by amplifying the initial orbital forcing (citation).
Bold added, IPCC [2001], ¶2.4.1. http://pame.arctic-council.org/climate/ipcc_tar/ wg1/072.htm. That was a close call for the catastrophists!
B. VOSTOK REMAPPED
In Figure 3, each pair of simultaneous readings of temperature and CO2 concentration is a dot on the graph, connected in sequence just to show that the time relationship is not lost. For example, the graph has labels for the ages of the first and last points. Without the paths, the dots form a constellation of data, as shown in Figure 4.
This analysis has no further call for the start and end marks. The graphs are just for human visualization of the data. At its roots, the information in the data is arithmetical.
III. MODELING VOSTOK CO2 CONCENTRATION
Engelbeen’s result is shown in Figure 5. He shows a best linear fit and a best quadratic fit, also known as the first and second order fits, respectively. Mathematics guarantees that increasing the order of the fit improves (or at least can’t worsen) the fit.
Mr. Engelbeen found this important Vostok relationship “surprisingly linear”. (Comment #2, http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=13#comment-69.) More importantly, his analysis confirms that the curvature in the data is not an optical illusion.
Curves like Engelbeen’s are purely mathematical fits. They indicate correlation, a mathematical relationship, but he gives them no connection to physics. The goal here is to uncover the physical relationship between the historic CO2 concentration and temperature. What causes the concentration effect to be curved as it is? In other words, can a cause and effect model be developed which might account for the correlation seen in the Vostok data?
A. CLIMATOLOGISTS CAN’T ACCOUNT FOR ATMOSPHERIC CO2
According to at least one report, climatologists are at a loss to explain the source of the CO2:
Where did the carbon dioxide come from? “This is one of the grand unsolved puzzles in climate research,” said Thomas Stocker, a climate modeler at the Physics Institute of the University of Bern. Schoen [1999].
Moreover and to the contrary, climatologists dismiss the oceans as the source. Gavin A. Schmidt (NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS), New York, New York; and Department of Earth and Environmental Sciences, Columbia University, New York, New York.) and his blog group at RealClimate believe …
The oceans cannot be a source of carbon to the atmosphere, because we observe them to be a sink of carbon from the atmosphere.
RealClimate, the Group, http://www.realclimate.org/index.php? p=160. Instead, this new analysis establishes that there is no contradiction in the oceans being simultaneously both a source and a sink.
The International Panel of Climate Change (IPCC) seems to agree with RealClimate:
[T]he observed increase in CO2 is predominately due to the oxidation of organic carbon by fossil-fuel combustion and deforestation.
IPCC [2001], C.1 Observed Changes in Globally Well-Mixed Greenhouse Gas Concentrations and Radiative Forcing. http://pame.arctic-council.org/climate/ipcc_tar/wg1/016.htm But predominantly means not completely. So IPCC concedes:
Thus, the terrestrial biosphere does not cause the difference in atmospheric CO2 between glacial and interglacial periods. The cause must lie in the ocean, and indeed the amount of atmospheric change to be accounted for must be augmented to account for a fraction of the carbon transferred between the land and ocean.
IPCC [2001], 3.3 Palaeo CO2 and Natural Changes in the Carbon Cycle, 3.3.1 Geological History of Atmospheric CO2. http://www.grida.no/climate/ipcc_tar/wg1/107.htm. That fraction Stocker estimates is about half:
“About 50% of the 80-ppm glacial-to-interglacial increase can be explained by a change in the solubility of carbon dioxide.”
Schoen [1999], above, continuing her Stocker quotation. The phrase “change in the solubility” can be read several ways. Regardless, the analysis here shows that the well–known, fixed and constant physics of the temperature–dependent solubility of CO2 in water accounts for all the Vostok CO2 concentration measurements.
B. SCIENTIFIC OBSERVATION: SOLUBILITY PHYSICS APPEARS TO ACCOUNT FOR ATMOSPHERIC CO2 CONCENTRATION

Figure 6
Solubility, X_1, of CO2 in water.
Handbook of Chemistry & Physics,
34th ed., 1953, Solubility of Gases
in Water, p. 1532. The curve is the
best–fit, fifth order by the author.
The complement of solubility, 1-X_1, represents the relative amount remaining in the air. (More precisely, the amount remaining in the atmosphere would be C-X_1, where C is an arbitrary constant. The constant C is immaterial to the slope of the curve, so does not enter into the fitting to the Vostok data. Therefore without loss of generality, C is shown as 1.)
As chartsmanship underscored the correlation between Vostok data traces, chartsmanship can make clear the correlation between the Vostok CO2 samples and CO2 solubility in water. Correlation is the key observation underlying this analysis. It is shown in Figure 7 by artful plotting of the complement of the solubility curve atop the Vostok data.
C. FITTING SOLUBILITY PHYSICS TO VOSTOK MEASUREMENTS
To measure this apparent effect of the solubility pump, the concentration of CO2 may be expressed in relative terms, too. In the following, where relative CO2 concentration is shown, it is in percent of the midpoint of the Vostok concentration, and gets the new label CO2r. Also for convenience, the temperature difference gets the popular nickname “Del T”, short for the conventional “Delta T”.
The straight line fit to the constellation of data in relative CO2 concentration is shown in Figure 8.
Correlation and straight line fits share some important properties. The straight line is the unique line that minimizes the total (sum square) error between itself and, in this case, the CO2 concentration ratio samples. That straight line has a slope of 3.42% per degree Centigrade. As shown below, this result places the Vostok data squarely on the solubility curve, showing a physically meaningful operating point.
D. THE OTHER STRAIGHT LINE FIT AND CORRELATION
The analysis could as easily have found the best fit straight line that minimizes the error between the fit and the temperature samples instead of the CO2 concentration. Conventionally, the independent variable is graphed on the x-axis, called the abscissa. But to this point, determining which of the variables might be independent and which dependent, is an objective of the analysis.
The choice of which is the dependent and which is the independent variable is often subjective, reflective of a presumed cause and effect model. Climatologists by their Greenhouse Catastrophe Model assume, and attempt to prove, that temperature is the dependent variable. The straight line fit corresponding to dependent temperature is shown alongside that for independent temperature in the next chart, Figure 9.
The catastrophe model has a slope of 21.6 degrees Centigrade per 100 percent change in CO2 concentration, or 0.216ºC/%.
The product of the two slopes is the mathematical “coefficient of determination”, conventionally labeled r2, with r being the “correlation coefficient”.
This dual line–fitting method unmasks some of the mystery of correlation. The smaller the angle between the lines, the stronger the correlation between the two variables. Here the product of the slopes is 0.740. Since the maximum is one, it is subjectively a fairly strong correlation (r = 0.860).
Others, however, have reported a lag in the CO2 data with respect to the temperature. Equivalently, temperature events lead or precede CO2 concentration changes. Good analytical techniques require quantification of that lead or lag, and offsetting the data traces to an optimum.
The adjustment is readily made because the graphing steps above preserve the information in the Vostok records. The offset has no effect on the conclusions reached, but does provide a small increase in accuracy.
E. MEASURING AND MODELING THE LAG IN THE CO2 DATA

Figure 12
Vostok sample record with CO2
offset to maximize its correlation
with the temperature record.

Figure 16
The first order Vostok CO2
concentration varies with
temperature according to the
solubility curve at
0.247 g/100 g water,
corresponding to a temperature
of 8.26ºC.
By convention, the Greek tau (t for time) stands for lag. The relation between correlation and tau is the correlation function. Auto–correlation is correlation of a record with itself, and cross–correlation is the correlation between two different records. Figure 10 contains the cross–correlation function of CO2 and temperature for the entire Vostok record of 400,000 years. (The graph is more dense on the left because of an intentional computational artifact. Sample intervals increase exponentially to simplify the computation load. The correlation method wraps the data on itself, analogous to a 420,000–year long tape loop.)
Zooming in by a factor of 100 shows the fine structure in the near term. This is Figure 11.
Three or four nearly equivalent peaks appear where carbon dioxide has the greatest correlation with temperature. The fact that the correlation is relatively poor at zero temperature offset emphasizes that the lag is real, and that any model should account for the lag. Subsequent analysis is offset to the nearest local peak in the correlation at 1073 years. As already stated, the correlation shift has no effect on the qualitative result, namely that CO2 is not responsible for but is a response to global temperature. Applying the lag to the model does improve the accuracy of the results by a few percent.
F. LAG–COMPENSATED CO2 RECORD
Offsetting the CO2 trace by 1073 years has the scientifically desirable effect of sharpening or flattening the constellation of data. This is an improvement in signal to noise ratio. It makes the curvature more apparent, as shown in Figure 12.
Again dropping the sample paths and representing the CO2 concentration in percentage produces the new constellation of ice core data, offset for maximum correlation, shown in Figure 13.
The best fit straight line through these points shows that the average variation of CO2 concentration is 3.49% per degree Centigrade, shown in Figure 14. The complementary, catastrophe straight line fit is 21.8ºC per 100% change in CO2 concentration, or 0.218ºC/%, included in Figure 15.
The offset for lag increased the slope from 3.42%/ºC to 3.49%/ºC with temperature as the independent variable, and the catastrophe slope from 0.216 ºC/% to 0.218 ºC/% CO2 with the greenhouse gas as the independent variable. The 1073 year offset slightly changes the operating point on the solubility curve. The product of the two slopes, r^2, is 0.7609, and r is thus increased from 0.860 to 0.872. (Computation of correlation by the straight line fit method does not involved data wrapping.)
For several reasons, the catastrophic fit can be put to rest. Carbon dioxide is dependent on temperature, and not the reverse. The reason is not just the fact that concentration lags temperature changes, but because it is a physical consequence of the ocean temperature distribution.
G. FINDING THE OPERATING POINT FOR THE VOSTOK CO2 RECORD ON THE SOLUBILITY CURVE
The slope of the solubility curve is 3.49%/ºC at 8.26ºC. This is where the straight line fit to the lag–adjusted Vostok CO2 concentration is tangent to the solubility curve. It occurs at the solubility level of 0.247 g/100g water, as shown in Figure 16.
Locating the first order operating point on the original solubility data is made difficult by the granularity of the solubility data. The final point comes from analysis of the slope of the solubility curve in various polynomial representations, as shown in Figure 17.
The Vostok CO2 data occur over a relative temperature region, which mathematicians call the domain, of 14ºC. The best fit of the solubility curve to the Vostok data occurs in the region of 0ºC to 14ºC, the segment of the solubility curve shown in Figure 18.
H. THE CO2 CONCENTRATION IN THE VOSTOK ICE CORE DATA IS IMPRINTED BY THE PHYSICS OF THE SOLUBILITY OF CO2 IN WATER
The operating region from the solubility curve transforms into a curve representing the Vostok CO2 concentration, as shown in Figure 19.
This segment of the solubility curve fit to the Vostok CO2 data accounts for all the Vostok CO2 data. That is, there is no additional concentration of CO2 in the Vostok record which is not imprinted with the solubility data. Additional, long term CO2 not involved in the solubility process would reduce the percentage variations, moving the operating point to hotter and physically meaningless temperatures, or even off the solubility curve altogether.
I. ERROR ANALYSIS SHOWS THE PHYSICS OF CO2 SOLUBILITY IN WATER REPRESENTS VOSTOK DATA BETTER THAN CAN ANY POLYNOMIAL
What remains is assessment of the goodness of the solubility fit and the consequences of the analysis.
First, the solubility curve lies comfortably within the one standard deviation bands of the best linear fit. That fit is shown in Figure 20.
The CO2 solubility model even fits well within the catastrophe trend, as shown in Figure 21.
In fact, the CO2 solubility representation of the relationship between the CO2 concentration data and temperature records at Vostok is superior to any reasonable polynomial fit, as shown by Figure 22.
Superimposed in Figure 22 are every polynomial fit to the Vostok data, from the first to the tenth degree, with temperature the independent variable. Unlike the polynomials, the solubility fit has well behaved end effects. At high orders, the polynomials chase measurement errors, including transient effects like volcano eruptions or forest fires, a weakness that worsens as the order increases. The solubility curve chases neither measurement errors nor transients.
The solubility fit is accurate to within a fraction of a percent of the least error, that of the highest order polynomial. The polynomials are slightly superior at error reduction because they have the effect of reducing measurement errors along with representing the physical process. Polynomials are malleable, mathematically guaranteed to fit the data of the underlying process along with the errors and disturbances, but physically meaningless. The solubility model shape is fixed by the underlying physics, and fits according to whether those physics are applicable. Lastly, the solubility model is insensitive to measurement errors or transient events.
IV. CONCLUSIONS
A. A NEW MODEL FOR ATMOSPHERIC CARBON DIOXIDE
Science is about models of the real world that, first of all, fit all the data. This analysis is a first step in postulating a scientific model for the CO2 observations. The short term objective here is to characterize the observed concentration that science demands future models reproduce, and to assess the consequences.
Looking beyond that characterizing of the Vostok data, the pattern in the data suggests a model for CO2 such as shown in the sketch of Figure 23.
Several processes are simultaneously underway in the Carbon Dioxide Stream of Figure 23. Superimposed on a latitude–temperature graph is the solubility curve (shown without its ordinate axis). Solubility gets a shaded thickness to suggest the temperature dependent potential to absorb or release CO2 everywhere.
The atmosphere is a cloud to portray the global mixing of atmospheric gases by the winds. The CO2 exchange should occur to some extent distributed over the surface of the ocean. It should also occur focused by the ocean’s meridional overturning circulation, also known as the thermohaline circulation, and popularly called a conveyor belt. The circulation descends at the poles and rises to touch the surface dominantly in the Indian Ocean and the Eastern Pacific. When the belt rises to the surface, the current is saturated with CO2 because of the rising temperature and falling pressure. It is ripe to release the gas.
Insofar as the thermohaline circulation governs the rate at which deep waters are exposed to the surface, it may also play an important role in determining the concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.
Wikipedia, Thermohaline Circulation. The Wikipedia entry also gives 1200 years as the period of the circulation, which is quite close to the observed lag, supplying additional corroboration for the model. See Figure 11, above. This source supplies no hint of the accuracy of the period, or of the probable geographic locations for the release of the CO2. See also http://www.grida.no/climate/vital/32.htm for a nice diagram of the circulation. For a recent revelation that integration of the ocean patterns into the GCMs was still a decade away, see IPCC [2001], Ch. 14 Advancing Our Understanding, ¶14.2.3.2 Thermohaline circulation. http://www.grida.no/climate/ipcc_tar/wg1/508.htm.
The distribution of evaporation and precipitation over the ocean (its hydrologic cycle) is one of the least understood elements of the climate system. However, it is now considered one of the most important, especially for ocean circulation changes on decadal to millennial time-scales.
The Ocean Component of the Global Water Cycle, Raymond W. Schmitt, Department of Physical Oceanography, Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, [2002]. http://www.earthscape.org/t1/scr01/scr01a.html.
The atmosphere only holds a few centimeters of liquid water, or 0.001% of the total.
heating one part in 100,000 of the water, he seems to attribute to the Man Behind the Curtain that
[i]n a stronger CO2 greenhouse climate it is hypothesized that the hydrologic cycle will intensify.
Id. The cause and effect perversely get reversed. Intensification of the hydrological cycle through heating of the ocean should increase the concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere, where it will have a minute effect on atmospheric temperature.
B. CARBON DIOXIDE SHOULD NO LONGER DRIVE PUBLIC POLICY
Over those 420,000 years, warm ocean water has regulated the concentration of CO2 by release of this gas into the atmosphere. Because there is no trace of build–up of CO2 from forest fires, volcanoes, or the oceans themselves, cold waters must be scrubbing CO2 out of the air. Since there is no difference between manmade and natural CO2, anthropogenic CO2 is sure to meet the same fate.
To the extent that the analyst’s Vostok temperature trace represents a global atmosphere temperature, so does the concentration of CO2. Thus, CO2 is a proxy for global temperature, and attempting to control global temperatures by regulating anthropogenic CO2 is unfounded, futile, and wasteful.
C. GREENHOUSE CATASTROPHE MODELS (GCMs)
Since the industrial revolution, man has been dumping CO2 into the atmosphere at an accelerating rate. However the measured increase in the atmosphere amounts to only about half of that manmade CO2. This is what National Geographic called, “The Case of the Missing Carbon”. Appenzeller [2004].
Climatologists claim that the increases in CO2 are manmade, notwithstanding the accounting problems. Relying on their greenhouse gas theory, they convinced themselves, and the vulnerable public, that the CO2 causes global warming. What they did next was revise their own embryonic global climate models, previously called GCMs, converting them into greenhouse gas, catastrophe models. The revised GCMs were less able to replicate global climate, but by manual adjustments could show manmade CO2 causing global warming within a few degrees and a fraction!
The history of this commandeering is documented in scores of peer-reviewed journal articles and numerous press releases by the sanctified authors. Three documents are sufficient for the observations here, though reading them is rocket science. (An extensive bibliography on climate, complete with downloadable documents, covering the peer-reviewed literature and companion articles by peer-published authors is available on line from NASA at http://pubs.giss.nasa.gov/.) The three are Hansen, et al., [1997], Hansen, et al., [2002], and Hansen, et al., [2005]. Among Hansen’s many co-authors is NASA’s Gavin Schmidt, above. He is a frequent contributor to the peer–reviewed literature, and he is responsible for a readable and revealing blog unabashedly promoting AGW. http://www.realclimate.org/.
The three peer-reviewed articles show that the Global Climate Models weren’t able to predict climate in 1997. They show that in the next five years, the operators decoupled their models from the ocean and the sun, and converted them into models to support the greenhouse gas catastrophe. They have since restored some solar and ocean effects, but it is a token and a concession to their critics. The GCMs still can’t account for even the little ice age, much less the interglacial warming.
All by themselves, the titles of the documents are revealing. The domain of the models has been changed from the climate in general to the “interannual and decadal climate”. In this way Hansen et al. placed the little ice age anomaly outside the domain of their GCMs. Thus the little ice age anomaly was no longer a counterexample, a disproof. The word “forcing” appears in each document title. This is a reference to an external condition Hansen et al. impose on the GCMs, and to which the GCMs must respond. The key forcing is a steadily growing and historically unprecedented increase in atmospheric CO2. “Efficacy” is a word coined by the authors to indicate how well the GCMs reproduce the greenhouse effect they want.
In the articles, Hansen et al. show the recent name change from Global Climate Models to Global Circulation Models, a revision appropriate to their abandonment of the goal to predict global climate. The climatologists are still engaged in the daunting and heroic task of making the GCMs replicate just one reasonable, static climate condition, a condition they can then perturb with a load of manmade CO2. The accuracy and sensitivity of their models is no longer how well the models fit earth’s climate, but how well the dozens of GCM versions track one another to reproduce a certain, preconceived level of Anthropogenic Global Warming. This suggests that the models may still be called GCMs, but now standing for Greenhouse Catastrophe Models.
In these GCMs, the CO2 concentration is not just a forcing, a boundary condition to which the GCM reacts, but exclusively so. In the GCMs, no part of the CO2 concentration is a “feedback”, a consequence of other variables. The GCMs appear to have no provision for the respiration of CO2 by the oceans. They neither account for the uptake of CO2 in the cold waters, nor the exhaust of CO2 from the warmed and CO2–saturated waters, nor the circulation by which the oceans scrub CO2 from the air. Because the GCMs have been split into loosely–coupled atmospheric models and primitive ocean models, they have no mechanism by which to reproduce the temperature dependency of CO2 on water temperature evident in the Vostok data.
GCMs have a long history. They contain solid, well-developed sub-models from physics. These are the bricks in the GCM structure. Unfortunately, the mortar won’t set. The operators have adjusted and tuned many of the physical relationships to reproduce a preconceived, desired climate scenario. There is no mechanism left in the models by which to change CO2 from a forcing to a feedback.
Just as the presence of measurable global warming does not prove anthropogenic global warming, the inclusion of some good physics does not validate the GCMs. They are no better than the underlying conjecture, and may not be used responsibly to demonstrate runaway greenhouse effects. Science and ethics demand validation before prediction. That criterion was not met before the climatologists used their models to influence public opinion and public policy.
The conversion of the climate models into greenhouse catastrophe models was exceptionally poor science. It is also evidence of the failure of the vaunted peer review process to protect the scientific process.
D. WHAT CLIMATOLOGISTS NEED TO DO
The GCMs need to be revamped. They need to have the primary thermodynamic loop restored. This is the chain of dynamic events from solar radiation, through the shading and reflection of clouds responding to temperature changes, absorption primarily in the ocean, and the transport and exchanges of heat and gases by which the oceans create and regulate the earth’s climate and atmosphere. The models need to reflect the mechanisms which make the earth’s climate not vulnerable, but stable.
The CO2 concentration is a response to the proxy temperature in the Vostok ice core data, not a cause. This does not contradict that CO2 is a greenhouse gas, but it does contradict the conjecture that the presence of a greenhouse gas has any destabilizing effect on global climate. Other forces overwhelm the conjecture of a runaway greenhouse effect. The concentration of CO2 is dynamic, controlled by the solubility pump. Global temperature is controlled first by the primary thermodynamic loop.
The Vostok data support an entirely new model. Atmospheric CO2 is absorbed by the oceans. Fires, volcanoes, and now man deposit CO2 into the atmosphere, but those effects are transient. What exists in steady state is CO2 perpetually pumped into the atmosphere by the oceans. Atmospheric CO2 is a dynamic stream, from the warm ocean and back into the cool ocean.
Public policy represented by the Kyoto Accords and the efforts to reduce CO2 emissions should be scrapped as wasteful, unjustified, and futile.
BIBLIOGRAPHY
Appenzeller, Tim, National Geographic Magazine, Feb. 2004, The Case of the Missing Carbon. http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0402/feature5/.
Hansen, J., et al., 1997. Forcings and chaos in interannual to decadal climate change. J. Geophys. Res. 102, 25679-25720, doi:10.1029/97JD01495.
Hansen, J., et al., 2002. Climate forcings in Goddard Institute for Space Studies SI2000 simulations. J. Geophys. Res. 107, no. D18, 4347, doi:10.1029/2001JD001143.
Hansen, J., et al., 2005. Efficacy of climate forcings. J. Geophys. Res. 110, D18104, doi:10.1029/2005JD005776.
International Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), Climate Change 2001: Working Group I: The Scientific Basis.
Schoen, Deborah, Learning from Polar Ice Core Research, Environmental Science & Technology, April 1, 1999 / Volume 33, Issue 7 / pp. 160 A-163 A. http://pubs.acs.org/hotartcl/est/99/apr/learn.html.
Schmitt, R. W., Department of Physical Oceanography, Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, [2002], Columbia Earthscape, “an online resource on the global environment”, The Ocean Component of the Global Water Cycle. http://www.earthscape.org/t1/scr01/scr01a.html.
Dr. Glassman has a BS, MS, and PhD from the UCLA Engineering Department of Systems Science, specializing in electronics, applied mathematics, applied physics, communication and information theory. For more than half of three decades at Hughes Aircraft Company he was Division Chief Scientist for Missile Development and Microelectronics Systems Divisions, responsible for engineering, product line planning, and IR&D. Since retiring from Hughes, he has consulted in various high tech fields, including expert witness on communication satellite anomalies for the defense in Astrium v. TRW, et al, and CDMA instructor at Qualcomm. Lecturer, Math and Science Institutes, UCI. Member, Science Education Advisory Board. Author of Evolution in Science, Hollowbrook, New Hampshire, 1992, ISDN 0-89341-707-6. He is an expert modeler of diverse physical phenomena, including microwave and millimeter wave propagation in the atmosphere and in solids, ballistic reentry trajectories, missile guidance, solar radiation, thermal energy in avionics and in microcircuit devices, infrared communication, analog and digital signals, large scale fire control systems, diffusion, and electroencephalography. Inventor of a radar on-target detection device, and a stereo digital signal processor. Published A Generalization of the Fast Fourier Transform, IEEE Transactions on Computers, 1972. Previously taught detection and estimation theory, probability theory, digital signal processing.
© 2006 JAGlassman. All rights reserved.
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Comments (96)
Jeff:
I do not understand the thermocoline of deep ocean currents. Where can I read more, or perhaps you can simply it for me?
al
[RSJ: Try thermohaline.]
Posted by Alvin Clavin | October 24, 2006 11:44 AM
For completeness, what does the correlation plot for temperature lagging CO2 look like (Figure 11 with negative tau)? Are there any peaks worth noting?
[RSJ: A graph showing the negative axis was easy to compute, but for the moment too difficult to post here in a comment. It shows a major peak around -800 years, and otherwise is roughly similar to the correlation along the positive axis. The two-sided graph supports well the conclusion not to use zero lag, but it leaves rather arbitrary which of many peaks one might use. The two-sided graph is roughly an even function, but quite noisy. It shows that one should not place too much reliance on cross-correlation. It provides a good clue how one might model the relationship between parameters, and may provide good rejection criteria.]
Posted by Stephen | October 30, 2006 9:53 PM
FYI, Gavin Schmidt has replied to this (though briefly).
[RSJ:See Gavin Schmidt's Response to the Acquittal of CO2 Should Sound the Death Knell for AGW on this blog.]
Posted by Crust | November 1, 2006 7:40 AM
Here is a graph that clearly shows the CO2 lagging the temperature changes;
http://www.daviesand.com/Choices/Precautionary_Planning/New_Data/IceCores1.gif
[RSJ: I recommend against drawing any such conclusions by eyeball assessment of parametric data plots. It's a numeric problem, suited to more objective computer calculation.]
Posted by Jesse | November 7, 2006 2:59 PM
Oceans and Global Warming
November 7th, 2006 by globalwarming2000
Number of science reviews in this field have linked solar activity to the climate change. Rise in global temperature is always accompanied by the rise in CO2 concentration. Human contribution may be significant but it is not critical. By far the greatest amount of CO2 is released by the world's oceans; they are also the largest absorbers. The release of CO2 is not, but its absorption is affected by the Sun. The culprits are UV and gamma radiations reaching the oceans' surface during periods of high sunspot activity.
Some 2 years ago I wrote:
Increased solar activity results in an increase of the harmful radiation, reducing bio-mass of the oceans' surface plankton trough process of sterilisation by irradiation. Result of this is reduced uptake of CO2 from the atmosphere and rising in the 'green-house' effect. Reverse process takes place during reductions in the solar activity
[RSJ: The consensus among climatologists seems to be that CO2 uptake by the oceans is affected by the solubility curve, wind, and land area, and that it runs between 92 and 107 PgC/yr. But where is their computation? And where is the physics of the additional radiation effects?]
Posted by C2j+Cjs | November 8, 2006 3:43 AM
Interesting. What peer reviewed journal will it appear in and about when?
[RSJ: Rev. 10/13/07. A well-publicized study by Naomi Oreskes started with 928 abstracts from refereed scientific journals published between 1993 and 2003 and containing the key phrase "climate change", or some say, "global climate change". Among these, she found that 75%, or 696, articles discussed what she considered the Consensus proposition: global warming is occurring because of manmade greenhouse gas. Of those 696, 100% agreed!
[The results prove not Oreskes' conclusion about the existence of a consensus, but instead that with a high probability, the refereed journals in her survey have, for whatever reasons, published no papers disputing the anthropogenic climate change conjecture.
[Consequently, submitting The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide to one of these refereed journals is a major waste of time.
[A journal dedicated to science and not a cause would seek out and encourage articles challenging the models of the day. That's how science must progress. Instead, too many journals screen against opposing views.
[Journals should adopt and publish standards for acceptance of its papers. They should, of course, require stylistic standards, clarity, and relevance to the field of the journal, but most importantly, compliance with the strict scientific method. The recommendation is that obedience to the scientific method be a prerequisite for peer review and publication, never a consequence of it. What Oreskes' study shows is the degree to which climatology has sunk to astrology, phrenology, sociology, and paranormal-ology, ostensibly peer-reviewed, published fields.
[Of course, any journal that wishes to publish The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide is free to do so at the cost of nothing but attribution. It has been reproduced on other blogs.
[Peer review in American science is severely compromised. It is undergoing a treasured rebirth on the Internet. Anyone, peer or not, is free to criticize by commenting on this blog. Peer silence indicates the absence of error or of the need for further exposition.]
Posted by Jeff Stewart | March 22, 2007 3:48 PM
Please comment on the linked plot. It explores some of the same concepts you have addressed.
I cross-plotted the Vostok data as you have, but used CO2 concentration as the independent variable as AGW advocates assume. I then used the logarithmic best-fit trend to project temperatures expected if CO2 is indeed "forcing" T.
The CO2 values come from the US South Pole Station, 1958-2004. These values are similar to those from other sampling sites, including Mauna Loa, suggesting good atmospheric mixing of CO2, and should be applicable to Vostok.
Temperature variation at Vostok is projected at 6.23d C in 2004.
Actual dT at Vostok over this period ranges from -1.8d C in 1960 to +2.3d C in 1980, reaching +0.8d C in 2004. Net change over the period is negligible.
This suggests to me that CO2 definitely is not forcing T.
[RSJ: The AGW advocates do assume that CO2 is the independent variable. However, they contradict that claim in the Third Assessment Report trying to account for the discovery that CO2 lags (the surrogate for) Temperature. To accommodate this inconvenient fact, the IPCC (aka the Consensus) conjectured that while some unknown process triggers a temperature rise, CO2 amplifies it. This conjecture is unsupported by measurements, and results in a model that fails to shape the CO2 concentration according to the complement of the solubility curve.
[Your plotting CO2 as the independent variable, that is, along the abscissa, unfortunately proves nothing. The fact that you found a functional fit likewise proves nothing about dependence or independence. You merely found a way to characterize the shape of the data. Almost any function convex down in the region would have produced a similar result, and looking at the data, a function convex up might have worked even better. As the Acquittal of CO2 shows, one investigator found a nice fit with a quadratic polynomial. Such mathematical regression is the way to "parameterize" (find a parametric equation) relating the variables, but it doesn't provide a cause and effect.
[What you need to do is postulate a cause and effect relationship, and then see if the physics of that C&E relationship fit the data. The complement of the solubility curve for CO2 in water does the trick, and it provides as good a fit as quite high order polynomials.
[I assume you did your curve fitting at zero lag. At what lags (or leads) do you get the best fit? That should give you a clue about which is the dependent variable. You need to explore the cross-correlation function between these data traces, along with a cause and effect model, to support the dependency analysis.
[Your data called "Predicted 1958-2004 Vostok Trend" appear to be the extrapolation of your logarithmic fit. Just to test your method, you might find the logarithmic fit with Temperature as your independent variable. Is the fit about as good? Now find the optimum lags and see which curve is best.
[The Vostok data are biased well above your logarithmic fit at CO2 concentrations from about 270 ppmv to 300 ppmv. Your logarithmic fit fails to predict above 270 ppmv.
[The reverse log fit might do much better, and your temperature extrapolation will be much hotter, maybe up to 10 degrees C in 2004. The point is that one method has as much validity as the other - none. You cannot draw a valid cause and effect (dependent/independent) conclusion from your method.
[Turn now to the well-mixed issue. The IPCC (Consensus) needs that assumption. Some of the graphs in the literature indicate that South Pole readings appear to be from the same population as readings from other parts of the globe, including in particular Mauna Loa in the TAR. This assumption is important to AGW claims that CO2 levels are at unprecedented levels and that man's CO2 pollution has a residence time in the atmosphere between multiple decades and centuries. The data contradict these conclusions, and draw into question the calibration methods used in the various readings.
[The residence time of CO2 is easily calculated from IPCC (Consensus) data. It is about 1.5 years to 2.0 years, depending on whether you include the leaf water uptake reported by the IPCC (Consensus).
[As to being well-mixed, the IPCC (Consensus) reports that the CO2 north-south gradient is ten times greater than the east-west gradient. This implies first that the east-west gradient is discernable, and second that the north-south gradient is at a minimum substantial, at least 10 times what is discernable. This directly contradicts the well-mixed assumption.
[The western Pacific Ocean perpetually emits a huge quantity of CO2. That gas rises at the Equator and splits toward the poles. It rises into Hadley cells which bring the gas down and feed it into the trade winds. This circulation puts Mauna Loa directly in the chimney of the great efflux of CO2 from the ocean. A little decadal shift in climate patterns could move this CO2 plume across Mauna Loa to cause some or all of the observed increases. On the other hand, the cold waters at the poles create a massive sink for CO2. The Vostok data are drawn from the interior of this sink.
[Charles Keeling, the father of the Mauna Loa measurements, warned not to mix such data. However, he was known to merge data from different locations by calibration techniques and adjustments. (Rev. 8/27/07.)
[Except for its well-mixed assumption, the IPCC (Consensus) offers no explanation for matching data from the sink to data from the source, nor how the gradient bias might have been removed by their data calibration.
[As a footnote to the unprecedented CO2 levels in the last 400 to 600 millennia, that is known with a 3% confidence. The present record has exceeded the Vostok maximum for about 50 years. The Vostok data are about 1,500 years between samples. The chances a similar epoch, if it existed, would have been caught by a Vostok sample is about 50/1500.
[The Consensus and the IPCC are wrong. CO2 does not persist for multiple decades or longer, but only for a couple of years. CO2 in the atmosphere is not well mixed, but has a substantial, circuitous gradient from the Equatorial effluxes to the polar uptakes. Present day CO2 is not known to any acceptable degree of confidence to be at unprecedented concentrations relative to the past 400 millennia. CO2 is not well-modeled as a slug of gas inserted as a forcing, but instead is overwhelmingly a temperature related feedback from the ocean.]
Posted by Ursus | April 15, 2007 5:07 PM
A little clarification- in doing this exercise I was not attempting to determine the cause of the shape of the Vostok data crossplot. I was attempting only to test the assumptions adopted by the AGW camp to see if these data support the hypothesis that CO2 forces T. Thus I assumed CO2 as the independent variable, a logarithmic relationship between CO2 and T, and no adjustment for lag.
[RSJ: I wasn't clear enough last time. (a) You didn't accomplish anything by making CO2 the independent variable. (b) Your logarithmic fit proves nothing. These methods cannot solve the Cause & Effect riddle of science. Lack of correlation can disprove C&E. The existence of correlation only suggests where a C&E relationship might exist to be modeled by physics (or chemistry even).]
Linear actually is a better fit and predicts a higher temperature, but again the "accepted" relationship is logarithmic.
[RSJ: You went half-way toward a function convex up. Try making an exponential fit, which is equivalent to making T your independent variable.
[I don't know what you mean by "the 'accepted' relationship is logarithmic." Do you have a reference for this claim? Did you happen to reject the linear fit because the T forecast was too big? You need to set an objective standard first.
[You don't want to fit data including a part that might constitute your validation specimens. Reserve the hypothetical future data as a test case to validate your model.]
I am a little puzzled about the CO2 data. I obtained both Mauna Loa and South Pole data from the CDIAC website. Both data sets apparently were processed by Keeling, and on comparison, show maximum divergence in 2004, the last year of record, of 2.8ppmv. This accounts for my assumption that atmospheric CO2 is well mixed. In fact, on cursory examination, the South Pole records show the lowest 2004 concentration of the eight stations reported worldwide, but varies from the highest only by 4 ppmv. But again, I am using the "accepted" data.
[RSJ: Puzzled is right. Physics indicates a CO2 gradient should follow the wind circulation from the tropical oceanic outgassing to the polar uptakes. The IPCC admits as much, but contradicts it. Keeling warned not to link data from sinks or sources. Yet Mauna Loa sits right in an outgassing plume, and the South Pole data come from inside a sink. The Mauna Loa data should not fit the polar data. Some climatologists linked the Mauna Loa data to the Sipple ice core data by arbitrarily shifting the few Sipple data 83 years! Was something like that done again? The burden is on the Consensus to justify the method Keeling or others employed. Otherwise, we must reject the results. The Consensus may not adjust data from different sources on the grounds that the gas is well-mixed, and then claim it is well-mixed because once adjusted it fit together. That is a bootstrap and abysmal science.]
The conclusion I draw from this plot is that if CO2 were forcing T in a logarithmic manner, we should see a temperature trend, based on 1958-2004 CO2 concentrations, scattered about the plotted projection, which obviously is not the case.
[RSJ: Why? You can fit a logarithmic function to any old scatter of data. You're lacking both an objective standard and a physical model.]
As an aside, I am most impressed by the lags in the Vostok data where T falls dramatically while CO2 remains high for thousands of years. I cannot see how this possibly could occur if the data are correct and if CO2 is forcing T, unless they represent some catastrophic events like massive and sustained volcanic eruption.
[RSJ: Your impressions and the drama of the traces are all subjective, and not science. You need to measure the lead-lag relationship, and that requires calculating the cross-correlation function. As the Acquittal of CO2 paper shows, this particular function exhibits lots of local peaks, including a few strong ones around 1 millennium. That suggests we should look at the 1 millennium thermohaline half circulation. We should find mechanisms for all the peaks.]
Posted by Ursus | April 19, 2007 8:49 AM
It seems you really don't understand what I was trying to accomplish. I wasn't looking for the same outcome you were, I was trying to hang the "consensus" with their own rope. That's why I used the tenets they accept, although I don't agree with them.
[RSJ response: Thanks for being persistent. I get your point now by reading your latest comments with reference to your chart at
[http://bp2.blogger.com/_DVW_My87o0E/ReTQzIHwdeI/AAAAAAAAADM/0jlif89LghQ/s1600-h/Temp+v+CO2b.jpg
[My apologies for not including the link with your first post.]
These are, (1), the Vostok data show a relationship between CO2 and dT, that relationship being that CO2 "forces" T; (2) a rise in CO2 produces a logarithmic rise in T (http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2005AGUFM.V41H..03R); (3), CO2 is well enough mixed in the atmosphere that CO2 levels reported for the South Pole station should approximate those at Vostok.
[RSJ: (1) The correlation at Vostok between CO2 and Temperature supported the Consensus' greenhouse gas conjecture. The lag discovered some time later disproved it. But data traces cannot establish cause and effect; something like the greenhouse effect or outgassing was necessary.
[(2) Your reference to the abstract was helpful to your claim where it said, "the effect of CO2 on temperature is logarithmic." However, I could find no way to retrieve the full text of the Ruddiman paper, even if I wanted to pay a fee (which I refuse to do). I had never run across a claim by the Consensus that CO2 and Temperature had a logarithmic relationship, and the abstract is for a 12/05 paper, well after the Consensus locked on to its conjecture. Regardless of the authority, your chart shows the logarithmic fit to be poor. And my paper, the Acquittal of CO2, posted on this cite shows that the relationship is the complement of the solubility curve, something quite different than logarithmic. The Ruddiman claim is dubious.
[If I might restate your point, it is that even with as poor a fit as logarithmic, the history of the CO2 and T relationship doesn't predict recent Vostok readings (which I take at face value). Much more downward convexity is needed, but the data are actually convex up. Your argument is valid without making any claims for the goodness of the logarithmic fit.
[(3) Vostok and the South Pole ice cores should be quite similar, well-mixed CO2 or not.]
Therefore, if the supposed "forcing" trend seen in the Vostok ice core data is applied to modern CO2 levels, Vostok should be much warmer than it is today. Should be even warmer assuming a linear fit, far warmer with a convex upward fit. But I stuck with the "consensus" tenets, it's off enough even when using them.
[RSJ: you're correct that with the better fits of linear or convex up, the ice core history makes CO2 a much worse predictor of Temperature. Whatever the mechanism is that the Consensus contends causes CO2 to force temperature, it remains hidden in GCM code. It seems to remain optimistic that the GCMs will eventually show that CO2 drives T.
[The GCMs as presently configured will never reveal the curvature between natural CO2 and Temperature. This is because the Consensus makes CO2 a forcing, inserting a slug and watching what happens to temperature. It needs to be a feedback for the overwhelming natural portion, and that alone should demolish the CO2 theory.
[But if the data don't fit, you must acquit. Nice discovery.]
I did not deal with the lag because it was unnecessary to demonstrate my point. In stating I was "impressed" by the lag, I meant that this seems to be the most compelling indication that CO2 does not force T, though I have not attempted to quantify or account for it.
Posted by Ursus | April 20, 2007 11:10 AM
I plotted up CO2 vs. temp records for Law Dome, Dome-C and the rest of EPICA, as you have done here (just for giggles, I was genuinely curious). In Dome-C, CO2 leads temperature.
[RSJ: This is remarkably good news for the IPCC folks (the Consensus on AGW). For the Third Assessment Report, they had invented the naked theory that while CO2 may not have actually CAUSED global warming, it somehow amplified it! This was because some accepted investigators reported that CO2 lagged the Vostok temperature trace, making a shambles of the CO2-cause temperature-effect conjecture.
[Now by lagged, a scientist means that the sample cross-correlation function has a significant lagging peak. Assumedly, you meant that you calculated the cross-correlation between Dome-C temperature and CO2 concentration and found a significant lead component for the CO2 - didn't you? Quantify for the readers, if you would, how the function looked. You didn't just eyeball the graphs, did you?]
Further, the error in age control of the Vostok cores does not permit your analysis, particularly in the early portion of the record.
[RSJ: What do you mean by "age control of the Vostok cores"? What is the error in the handling or analysis of the Vostok cores, and in what way do you claim it affects the analysis in the Acquittal of CO2? What of the Vostok record must be disregarded? This will truly disappoint the Consensus.
[But not to worry. The analysis in the Acquittal of CO2 assumes that each CO2 concentration reading is at the temperature reading at the greatest ice age less than the given gas age. In theory, a large mean error between the two reported ages could disrupt the correlation and the pattern evident between CO2 and Temperature. This did not happen, however. With whatever errors were manifest in the data, the CO2 and Temperature traces were still highly correlated (86%). The pattern matched the complement of the solubility curve as well as any mathematical polynomial up to 10th order. Natural CO2 comes from the ocean. It is a product of global warming, not a cause.]
I am no doubter or promoter of 'global warming' etc. but you need to do a little more research (and cite some people for cripe's sake) before you conduct such an analysis.
[RSJ: When you became not a doubter or promoter of global warming, but a fan and promoter of Anthropogenic Global Warming, how did you judge the science and reasoning? Was there something specific you appreciated, or was it just a matter of the alleged voting? In science, someone always has to go first. How do you measure the adequacy of his research? If the research in the Acquittal of CO2 was inadequate, it must have overlooked something relevant. You must have discovered a paper that refutes the Acquittal of CO2. Please share it.]
It is typical of the arrogance of physics to think such a complex problem can be distilled into an equation (if it could, our climate models would be a little more precise, eh?). This is not 'consider a spherical cow' and I find the science and reasoning of the prominent geologists and climate scientists to be much more sound than this analysis. Moreover, they have a far greater understanding of the system.
[RSJ: Physics has arrogance!? Climate models are filled with equations, and they still can't predict. Climatologists, not climatology, urge public policy based on models that neither predict nor match the historical record. That is not arrogant; it is unethical. A few more equations are certain to be added to the GCMs. But remember, climate is a statistic; don't expect precision. ]
The stoichiometric control over CO2 equilibrium between atmospheric and oceanic reservoirs is a compelling argument, but you have neglected to mention the C sinking effects of oceanic biomass (our friends the foraminifera and nano-plankton) -- changing calcite compensation depth and the net sinking of carbon via CaCO3 in the deep ocean account for a great deal of the CO2 variability observed in the long-term record (check out some of Wally Broecker's work). For instance, what is your mechanism for the early to mid-Holocene CO2 anomaly? Your proposed mechanism requires a fundamental change in the ocean conveyor over very short time-scales to induce such events; from what we know about thermohaline circulation and the ocean conveyor, these changes would require great volumes of freshwater dumped into the North Atlantic, or some other such mechanism.
[RSJ: As to "stoichiometric control over CO2 equilibrium", I give you Caveman's answer: "Yeah, I have a response. What?" Besides, how could the Acquittal of CO2 be negligent in not mentioning an irrelevancy?
[The Acquittal of CO2 shows that in the Vostok record, the atmospheric CO2 concentration is curved according to the complement of the solubility of CO2 in water. A sound physical reason supports this result. That curvature of atmospheric CO2 is not modeled in the GCMs. Instead, the operators insert a massive slug of CO2 as a forcing, allowing it to decay slowly over several decades to a century plus. That is now known to be false from the Vostok record, and it is contradicted by the climatologists calculations in the TAR showing 90 GT or more of carbon uptake by the oceans per year. The Consensus position is supported by their well-mixed CO2 conjecture, but that, too, is contrary to the IPCC admission of large gradients (at least ten times the minimum detectable) in CO2 atmospheric concentration. It is also contrary to the physics of the CO2 exchange with the ocean. These findings demolish the CO2 forcing model. As a minimum, the great majority of atmospheric CO2 should be represented as a climatology feedback.
[Not only did the Acquittal of CO2 not mention anything like a "stoichiometric control of CO2 equilibrium", it relied on no stoichiometry at all. Even the TAR refers to stoichiometry only three times, and then with no real consequence. Nor does the TAR make mention of any "Holocene anomaly". Climatologists recognize Holocene anomalies, as in the El Niño Southern Oscillation (ENSO), and in insolation. But the TAR says the CO2 concentration was flat, between 260 and 280 ppmv, during the Holocene, making it actually anomalous. Whatever you mean by "mid-Holocene CO2 anomaly", the paper needs no mechanism for it. It is irrelevant to the inconvenient Vostok data.
[The TAR says, "The total amount of carbon in the ocean is about 50 times greater than the amount in the atmosphere, and is exchanged with the atmosphere on a time-scale of several hundred years. Dissolution in the oceans provides a large sink for anthropogenic CO2, due in part to its high solubility, but above all because of its dissociation into ions and interactions with sea water constituents (see Box 3.3)." Then it says, "This process depletes surface CO3(2-), reduces alkalinity, and tends to increase pCO2 and drive more outgassing of CO2 (see Box 3.3 and Figure 3.1)." Thus the chemical processes are alleged to crate an excess of the carbonate ion, CO3, which is supposed to be a bottleneck to the absorption of CO2!
[This incorporates much of the following opinion of David Archer, a contributing author to the TAR, and while not W. S. Broecker, at least one of his co-authors. Elsewhere Archer has claimed,
["When you release a slug of new CO2 into the atmosphere, dissolution in the ocean gets rid of about three quarters of it, more or less, depending on how much is released. The rest has to await neutralization by reaction with CaCO3 or igneous rocks on land and in the ocean. These rock reactions also restore the pH of the ocean from the CO2 acid spike. My model indicates that about 7% of carbon released today will still be in the atmosphere in 100,000 years. I calculate a mean lifetime, from the sum of all the processes, of about 30,000 years. That's a deceptive number, because it is so strongly influenced by the immense longevity of that long tail. If one is forced to simplify reality into a single number for popular discussion, several hundred years is a sensible number to choose, because it tells three-quarters of the story, and the part of the story which applies to our own lifetimes."
[This is patent nonsense on two separate grounds. First according to the TAR, about 65% of the 730 GT of atmospheric CO2 is removed every year. That gives a mean residence time of 1.52 years, and a half-life of 0.65 years. Second, the dissolution of atmospheric CO2 in water is a physical process, not a chemical reaction. The ratio of carbonate, bicarbonate, carbon dioxide and carbonic acid, and hence the pH, will adjust thermodynamically until the CO2 concentration is on the solubility curve for CO2 in water. Archer and the TAR make the solubility depend not on just temperature and pressure, but also on the carbonate concentration or the pH. This would be a major new result in physics!
[Lastly, it is nonsense because the ocean is not stagnant as the ionic build-up conjecture suggests. The solubility pump loads CO2 in the cold waters, transports it deep and undersaturated at high pressure, returning it to the surface, heated and at atmospheric pressure, to be unloaded from saturated water. The water then circulates on the surface to cool and reabsorb CO2 from the air. The solubility pump depends on the solubility curve, and needs no modification. It accounts well for the Vostok record.]
Finally, you entirely ignore the atmospheric physics at play here. For the sake of entertainment, if the post-IR CO2 increases are anthropogenic, that does this change the fact that CO2 is indeed a very effective greenhouse gas?
[RSJ: If we assume the AGW conjecture is valid, then the AGW conjecture is valid. But, it is not. The adjectives "indeed" and "very effective" don't help. Anthropogenic CO2 is quite as effective as natural CO2, but not as effective as H2O, each of which overwhelm the ACO2 in quantity and effectiveness.]
We've pumped a great deal of it into the atmosphere in a very short amount of time, can you deny the physics of surface warming due to this increase?
[RSJ. Yes. It is not zero, just negligibly small. Watch this blog for additional explanations.]
I've met very few physicists who dared deny it. Your arguments are indeed well thought out, but poorly researched. I would be slightly more convinced if you took the time to do your homework on the subject and publish it.
[RSJ. It is published!]
Nevertheless, I'm circulating this with my colleagues just to see what they think. Thanks for entertaining this long-winded post, I'm neither a nay-sayer nor dooms-dayer, but I want to see all the data considered; something you've failed to do.
-Morgan
[RSJ: Where along the AGW route did Morgan fall off the AGW bandwagon? Does he deny that he bought into yet another doomsday scenario?]
Posted by morgan | May 8, 2007 9:15 PM
You posit that CO2 does NOT accumulate in the atmosphere. How do you explain atmospheric concentrations of CO2 increasing over the last 100 years?
[RSJ: A full response appears as a separate entry: On Why Co2 Is Known Not To Have Accumulated in the Atmosphere & What Is Happening with Co2 in the Modern Era, 6/11/07. ]
Posted by Myles Goodman | June 6, 2007 12:03 AM
You make the perceptive comment that the Mauna Loa Observatory results may be significantly impacted by the MLO's relative proximity to the equatorial ocean regions where the significant amount of the CO2 release is taking place. Since the amount of the release of CO2 will be controlled by both the CO2 content and the surface temperature of the ocean, the theory could be tested by looking for the impact of El Nino events on the MLO data. If MLO data is impacted by its proximity, the ocean surface temperature change during El Nino should be sufficient to show up in the MLO data.
[RSJ: Many articles are available on line that identify El Niño events in the Mauna Loa data. Keeling himself along with his fellow researchers, especially Bacastow, investigated the El Niño relationship to the Mauna Loa measurements.
[http://scrippsco2.ucsd.edu/program_history/charles_david_keeling_biography.html
[Note the References at
[http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/sio-mlo.htm
[(2) Keeling's model of the Southern Oscillation Index included upwelling and releasing of about 0.6 GTons per year of CO2 from depths of 50 to 150 meters during periods when the SOI was positive, that is, during La Niña states. In the opposing, El Niño states, he claimed there was no appreciable CO2 flux. Keeling, C.D. and R. Revelle, Effects of El Nino/Southern Oscillation on the Atmospheric Content of Carbon Dioxide, Meteoritics, Vol. 20, No.2, Part 2, June 30, 1985. P. 437.
[(3) The great bulk of the 90 to 100 GTons of ocean CO2 outgassing appears to be associated with the thermohaline circulation, known under various names, including the ocean conveyor belt. By comparison, SOI effects may be minor eddy currents. Most of the outgassing occurs south and east of Hawaii, where it rises into the Hadley cells, then north and down into the trade winds feeding the Islands.
[Maps of air-sea CO2 flux, along with charts of the THC, strongly support the deep current theory. The maps, frequently attributed to Taro Takahashi, were prepared from pCO2 measurements, the surface wind, and the gas transfer velocity. IPCC, Fourth Assessment Report, p. 523, Figure 7.8. See also
[http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/res/pi/CO2/carbondioxide/pages/air_sea_flux_rev1.html
[The following site provides a map of the Mean Annual Air-Sea Flux for 1995 for non-El Niño conditions! http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/pubs/outstand/feel2331/images/fig06.jpg
[linked from
[http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/pubs/outstand/feel2331/feel2331.shtml
[Somewhere on line you might find an animated, monthly Takahashi map.]
Posted by Tom Klein | June 24, 2007 2:13 PM
Thanks for the references. Keeling & Whorf paper indicates that they recorded the largest increase in CO2 content in the year 1998 - a very strong El Nino year - . The increase in that year, 2.87 ppmv, was more than double than the 46 year average of 1.4 ppmv. Monthly data also show that the largest year to year increases were in the months of August 1998 to about February 1999, the period of the strongest El Nino activity.
Tom Klein
RSJ: Keeling and Revelle discussed the effects of El Niño, including on the carbon cycle, in Effects of El Nino/Southern Oscillation on the Atmospheric Content of Carbon Dioxide, Meteoritics, Vol. 20, No.2, Part 2, June 30, 1985. P. 437. The IPCC Third Assessment Report restates much of what K&R said, but in the summary omitting the part about the CO2. See Climate Change 2001, Technical Summary of the Working Group I Report, p. 52. Climate Change 2001 discusses the El Niño/CO2 link in the context of CO2 variability, and notes the conincident "reduced upwelling of CO2-rich waters". Id., pp. 208-209. Then it concludes with the following observation:
[In any case, the slowdown (of the early 1990s) proved to be temporary, and the El Niño of 1998 was marked by the highest rate of CO2 increase on record, 6.0 PgC/yr. Id., p. 210.
[This is your citation, and it contradicts Keeling's earlier model.
[The correlation between El Niño events and atmospheric CO2 concentration was shattered. It might be repaired by examining the correlation between SOI and the CO2 concentration data a bit less processed than the Keeling curve. For more, see RSJ, Solar Wind, El Niño/Southern Oscillation, & Global Temperature: Events & Correlations, 7/6/07.
[Outgassing from the thermohaline circulation is a better model than the damaged El Niño model because it, too, accounts for the shape of CO2 concentration with temperature (the complement of the solubility curve) and it accounts for the one millennium lag. Moreover, the THC-CO2 model fits the Takahashi maps. ]
Posted by Tom Klein | June 25, 2007 3:59 PM
Dear Dr Glassman,
I was delighted to see your analysis here. As an electronics engineer I had been surprised by the EPICA Dome C data which also shows the same phenomena. CO2 lags behind Temperature. Naturally I visited Real Climate to understand why the ice cores are considered crucial to demonstrating the validity of MMGW theory. On their site they mention that CO2 forces temp in a positive feedback mechanism. I then went back to the EPICA Dome C data and found that the increase in temperature at the end of an interglacial is linear, not exponential as you would expect for a positive feedback mechanism. Furthermore, there is no point of inflection in the temperature curve at the time when the CO2 starts to rise. Basically this claim is untrue, as you have said.
Well done for sticking your neck out on this.
One worrying thing have noticed is that since the meaning of the ice core data has been disputed, it is very difficult to get hold of graphs on the internet with high resolution showing the EPICA Dome C data. They were common a while ago, with a good graph being given on Wikipedia. Now you can only find the graphs with a running averager applied to the data to remove the 800year lag and all the peculiar peaks and troughs ironed out. It is shocking that supposedly reputable scientists are prepared to lie to the public to support this highly dubious science.
Keep up the good work.
Regards, P. Hoy.
[RSJ: Interesting points about the shape of data under positive feedback.
[If there were a positive feedback in effect between a greenhouse gas and temperature, the growth of water vapor caused by hotter surface temperatures could have turned Earth into a suffocating hothouse long ago. Sufficient positive feedback will destroy the system or exhaust its dynamic range. The dynamic range limit for water vapor is the vaporization of the last of the liquid water. (Rev. 8/27/07.)
[The paucity of good data is a huge problem in this field. The global "Temperature anomaly", like all other data series, should be published without temporal smoothing. The Mauna Loa CO2 concentration since 1958 should be accompanied by a record of the local wind vector and time of day, assuming those data were recorded. From time to time, I have suspected that the Mauna Loa data are a composite including other sites, that it has been adjusted for El Niño events, or that it has been subjected to temporal smoothing. The data should be unambiguous about any such processing, and it should be published without it.]
Posted by Phillip Hoy | July 9, 2007 9:31 AM
Hello Dr. Glassman
I just posted your Solar Wind article on Global Warming Skeptics homepage. It is an excerpt (The introduction section) The rest of your interesting paper is linked to your website blog.
I have already posted your paper: The acquittal of CO2 on the GWS website about 3 months ago and repeated on the homepage recently. It got 62 (the repost) reads meaning they went to your link to read the rest.
I also posted Gavin Schmidt's response too. It got 40 reads meaning they went to your link to read the rest.
I also posted The Acquittal of CO2 at an Atheist forum. A few months ago. There they called you names. I kept trying to get them to make a rebuttal against your paper. They kept resisting as they/ kept calling you unflattering names.
I posted it because there were a number of people who claimed to be a scientist who subscribe to the CO2 warming propaganda. I wanted to see if they with science backgrounds find problems with your paper. After a lot of prodding on my part to get these name callers to make a rebuttal. One person finally did and it was not a good one.
I was not impressed.
I will admit that I struggle to understand what you write because I lack a science background. However I do read a lot on the subject and now participate in posting a mix of articles on a Global Warming Skeptic website.
We accept that there has been some warming over the last 100 years. We just do NOT accept the idea that mankind's CO2 emissions adds a lot of warming effect to the atmosphere.
Thank you for your time and effort to post your papers for us to read and learn.
If you want I can provide the link to the ATHEIST forum. If you care to respond.
Cheers
[RSJ: 10/5/04. The promos are appreciated. Sorry I don't know enough about your sites yet to comment on them.
[At some risk of pedantry, but in the interest of promoting the precision science demands, allow me to reflect on the names "Global Warming Skeptics" and the Atheist forum.
[Global Warming is a fact not to be rationally denied. That climate on any scale is either warming or cooling is a tautology. It's a fractal-like property. At present, Earth is warming from the last Ice Age, from the last Glacial epoch, and from the Little Ice Age. The inevitable turn-around is not in sight. But to the discredit of the Consensus on climate, it shows no sign of accounting for this warming background before it computes what it considers presently to be an anomalous warming. What should be controversial is not Global Warming but Anthropogenic Global Warming.
[Why "Global Warming Skeptics"? To deny global warming is equivalent to denying ice ages.
[But skepticism is a quality of every good scientist. When the Consensus attacks skeptics as contrarians, it exposes a deficit in its science literacy. As a minimum, every member of the Consensus community should be skeptical, especially of its own results, fraught with uncertainty, lack of success, and want of forthrightness. As to the contrarian accusation, it is the rejection of the crowd and a widely shared belief. Science is neither a democracy nor a repository for belief systems.
[I was piqued by the thought of a peculiar interest an atheist forum might have in errors in the AGW conjecture. I do grant you the Consensus is an evangelical group for a new theology. The fruits of conversions in the new temple are the heady stuff of power and money.
[On the other hand, scientific models are, and indeed must be, secular (in the theological not chronological sense). That is not atheistic, and no legitimate model should provide any support for atheism.
[Won't you share the unworthy comment?
[If you have difficulty at some point in reading one of my papers, please post a pointed comment. Perhaps a clarification would get you back on track, and help others.]
Posted by Sunsettommy | July 19, 2007 8:35 PM
Consulting my old textbook in inorganic chemistry, written in 1978, I found some numbers which are quite illuminating.
Atmospheric CO2: 330 ppm by volume corresponding to 480 ppm by weight.
Oceanic CO2: 100 ppm by weight.
The bottom line:
2.4E15 kg CO2 in the atmosphere
1.4E17 kg CO2 in the oceans
5E14 kg CO2 biomass flux
2E13 kg CO2 added yearly from fossil fuels
So the rise from 330 to 380 ppm (+15% in 29 years) would be caused by man adding a fraction of a per cent to the total of the CO2-stream?
If man would burn fossil fuels at the rate of 1978 for 7000 years, the amount of CO2 in the CO2-stream would double. I can live with those numbers.
[RSJ: 10/29/07. Your numbers are part of a set that is a linchpin of the AGW theory: the residence time of anthropogenic CO2 in the atmosphere. For a brief discussion of the topic see On Why CO2 Is Known Not To Have Accumulated in the Atmosphere & What Is Happening with CO2 in the Modern Era in the Journal, and written before the new Fourth Assessment Report could be absorbed. This is a good opportunity to update that report a bit.
[First, a brief facts check is appropriate. Your CO2 concentrations of 330 ppmv and 380 ppmv fit the data in the IPCC Third Assessment Report (TAR) (Figure 3.2a, p. 201) and its Fourth Assessment Report (4AR) (Figure 2.3, p. 138).
[Apparently you did a multiplication by volume or weight in the reservoirs for the two stocks, and something similar for the two fluxes, too. Your set of four numbers in Petagrams (1 Pg = 10^15g) along with the usual government authorities, is in the table below.
Parameter
Ivarsson
TAR
4AR
NASA
[8/24/08. Table corrected. Thanks to David.
[The IPCC TAR and 4AR columns are from Climate Change 2001, Figure 3.1, p. 188; and Climate Change 2007, Figure 7.3, p. 515, respectively. The NASA column offered as a check is from NASA at http://science.hq.nasa.gov/oceans/system/carbon.html.
[As discussed previously, the Consensus treats natural and anthropogenic as if they flowed in separate physical channels, and obeyed different physics. Now, the Fourth Assessment Report gives further evidence of this view. See Figure 7.3, http://ipcc-wg1.ucar.edu/wg1/Figures/AR4WG1_Ch07-Figs_2007-06-05.ppt .
[For 4AR Figure 7.3, the Consensus divides the 763 PgC in the atmosphere into 597 Pg of natural carbon plus 165 Pg of anthropogenic carbon. Its total exchange rate for all sources of natural carbon is 0 PgC/yr, while the net exchange of anthropomorphic CO2 is +3.2 PgC/yr.
[This model shows the ocean absorbing 70 Pg/year of natural carbon, and outgassing 70.6. Meanwhile, it has the ocean absorbing 22.2 PgC of anthropogenic carbon, and outgassing 20 PgC. The IPCC provides no physical basis to account for the oceanic uptake of 11.7%/yr (70/597) of natural CO2 (nCO2), while the uptake is 13.5%/yr (22.2/165) for anthropogenic CO2 (ACO2). If the Consensus on Climate relies on geographical differences in the concentration of nCO2 and ACO2, as might be coupled with differences in Sea Surface Temperature, then it runs afoul of its well-mixed conjecture.
[In this IPCC model of the carbon cycle, the total absorption rate of nCO2 from the atmosphere is 190.2 PgC/yr from a reservoir of 597 PgC. For ACO2, the total rate is 24.8 PgC/yr from a reservoir of 165 PgC. Then by the IPCC's own definition (4AR, Annex I, p. 948, Lifetime), the lifetime of nCO2 is 3.14 years and of ACO2 is 6.65 years.
[The lifetime numbers are not indeterminate. They are not in the range of a decade to centuries. And they imply a profound difference in physics that at best might provide a fragile alternative to account for small measurement differences in isotopic fractions.
[The Consensus assumes that the natural greenhouse gases, and specifically CO2, are in equilibrium and constant. Then it claims the measured concentration increases from the "Keeling curve" are anthropogenic in origin (4AR, ¶1.3.1, p. 100), confirmed by the 13C/12C isotopic decline at Mauna Loa (id., pp. 138-139). Consequently, the Consensus concludes the residence time of CO2 and the uptake and outgassing fluxes must differ between the natural and the anthropogenic species of CO2.
[The Mean Residence Time for CO2 is about 4 years. Climate Change 2001, p. 793. It is 150 years, too. Id., p. 386. It is 5 to 200 years, and "[n]o single lifetime can be defined for CO2 because of the different rates of uptake by different removal processes." Id., Table 1, Technical Summary, p. 38. "CO2, which has no specific lifetime". Id., p. 824.
[But to the contrary, the IPCC provides a definition and formula for lifetime in the Appendices to both the TAR and the 4AR. While the IPCC gives lifetime several equivalent names, it remains unambiguous. It depends on the size of the reservoir, M, and the total rate of removal from all sources, S. It is a balloon with multiple leaks, some large and some small. This is exactly the same analogy as a bucket with several leaks in the bottom provide earlier on this blog. The concept is elementary and is not confused by different size leaks. The formula depends on the total rate of removal, and not on the individual rates of removal comprising the total.
[To the IPCC, policy trumps science. Residence time is more than just a technical matter. As the Consensus says,
[The … atmospheric residence time of the greenhouse gas - is a highly policy relevant characteristic. Namely, emissions of a greenhouse gas that has a long atmospheric residence time is a quasi-irreversible commitment to sustained radiative forcing over decades, centuries, or millennia, before natural processes can remove the quantities emitted. Bold added, Climate Change 2001, Technical Summary, p. 38.
[In the TAR, the IPCC offers an explanation for the "current thinking" on physics that "may" distinguish between natural and anthropogenic CO2. See Climate Change 2001, ¶3.2.3.2, Uptake of anthropogenic CO2, p. 199. It uses inconclusive words and phrases, including "implies", "may play a significant role", "tended to increase", "implying", and "tightly correlated … but not exactly … matching". It introduces the concept of "'old' waters" with differing rates of CO2 uptake as the discussion touches on the physics of the carbon cycle, limitations on the solubility of CO2, and methods for assessing the ratio of nCO2 to ACO2 in the atmosphere and the ocean.
[Three years later on 12/16/04, the AGW proponents at RealClimate.org posted, "How do we know that recent CO2 increases are due to human activities?" It was an effort to shore up the IPCC explanation. It introduced the isotopic discrimination method, saying "One of the best illustrations of this point, however, is not given in IPCC. Indeed, it seems not all that well appreciated in the scientific community, and is worth making more widely known." The first try didn't work, so it was rewritten ten days later. http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=87. It says, "However, it is the fact that we produce CO2 faster than the ocean and biosphere can absorb it that explains the observed increase." This alleged fact begs the question.
[Then the RealClimate defense says,
[Another, quite independent way that we know that fossil fuel burning and land clearing specifically are responsible for the increase in CO2 in the last 150 years is through the measurement of carbon isotopes. … CO2 produced from burning fossil fuels or burning forests has quite a different isotopic composition from CO2 in the atmosphere. Id.
[No error analysis is offered for this method of discrimination. The references are variously immaterial or not publicly available.
[RealClimate's rehabilitated explanation still doesn't work to explain a model that implies that nCO2 and ACO2 have different solubility curves, nor that they can be faithfully modeled as if physically segregated.
[The Carbon Dioxide Information Analysis Center makes a good case for a steady decline in the 13C/12C isotopic ratio background since 1980. Each of ten sites distributed across the globe from 150W to 180W shows a decline. http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/iso-sio/graphics/iso-graphics.html. Consequently, a model other than burning fossil fuels is needed, and the IPCC provides it for the first time in the Fourth Assessment Report. It is an even more implausible model: the ocean outgases 20 PgC/yr of ACO2. The IPCC struggles to maintain its anthropogenic CO2 conjecture but has no coherent model.
[Changes in the 13C/12C ratio of atmospheric CO2 thus indicate the extent to which concurrent CO2 variations can be ascribed to variations in biospheric uptake. The calculation also requires specification of the turnover times of carbon in the ocean and on land, because fossil fuel burning implies a continuous release of isotopically light carbon to the atmosphere. This leads to a lowering of the atmospheric 13C/12C isotope ratio, which takes years to centuries to work its way through the carbon cycle (Keeling et al., 1980; Tans et al., 1993; Ciais et al., 1995a,b). Bold added, Climate Change 2001, Box 3.6, p. 207.
[Is this a reference to two turnover times, one for the ocean and one for land, or to four turnover times, taking into account different physics for light and heavy CO2? The Consensus doesn't reveal how the turnover times affect the calculation, nor why the lifetimes run into centuries, which is contrary to its own data.
[Three of the four references are not freely available to the public, and are not sufficiently cited by the IPCC Report. The abstracts can be read on line, but none even suggests the claims made for the IPCC passage. For Keeling et al, 1980, see
[http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1980GeoRL...7..505K. Back issues available only from 1994.
[For Ciais et al., 1995a, see
[http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/269/5227/1098?ijkey=376bc8031f92290b46a51f3ef76686e6f6d4c9a8&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha. AAAS membership required.
[For Ciais et al, 1995b, see
[http://www.agu.org/pubs/crossref/1995/94JD02847.shtml. This paper may be purchased for $9.
[The fourth reference, Tans et al., 1993 ("Tans"), by Pieter P. Tans, Joseph A. Berry, and Ralph F. Keeling, is the only reference freely available, and it not only does not support the IPCC claims, but refutes them.
[In the abstract, Tans declares,
[The main cause of the change (of carbon isotopic ratios) occurring today is the combustion of fossil fuel carbon with lower δ13C values.
[This would indeed support the IPCC claims, except that it is a presumption for the analysis to follow. Nowhere in the paper does Tans establish that fossil fuels produce lighter CO2, nor that other sources of CO2 are all heavier. Without evidence, it is a presumptive, requisite incantation to peers.
[For Tan's analysis to proceed, his presumption implies that light CO2 emissions be uniquely from fossil fuel. Then to evaluate his equations, Tams assigns a "reasonable value" (p. 364) for δ13C of fossil fuel CO2, δf , of -27.2‰. Tans, p. 357, Table 1. With that, he compares two methods. If they had agreed Tans et al would have had corroboration for the light CO2 presumption. But they didn't. So Tans theorizes,
[There could be a process in the real ocean affecting the transfer of CO2 that has thus far been overlooked or has not been properly quantified and/or simulated in the laboratory. If so, its contribution to isotopic fractionation would still have to be determined. Id., p. 366
[Indeed! The overlooked process is the solubility pump, the cycle of oceanic surface currents from Equator to the poles, and back through the thermohaline circulation. The surface waters cool, absorbing CO2, descending to the ocean depths to rise at the Equator, warmed and again at atmospheric pressure to exhaust CO2 back into the atmosphere. See The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide.
[Tans' isotopic model represents the ocean surface as a point, and the ocean as a column. With respect to the ocean, his is a one dimensional model. He represents the concentration of carbon as Co(z), a variable dependent on depth in the ocean, z, alone, and not as Co(x, y, z), where x and y are Cartesian equivalents of latitude and longitude. The total concentration of C in the ocean would be ∫Co(x,y,z)dA = ∫Co(x,y,z)dxdydz, which is equal to A∫Co(z)dz if Co is constant over the surface of the ocean. The last term is Tans expression for the total oceanic surface carbon (id., equation (3), p. 354), so he has tacitly assumed Co is constant over the surface of the ocean. That is known not to be true. Also, Tans has a single variable, Foa, representing the outgassing of CO2 from his single point ocean model. Instead, Foa is highly dependent on location, as represented in the solubility pump model above, and by Takahashi and now cited by the IPCC (Fourth Assessment Report, p. 523, Figure 7.8). Tans model does not account for the dynamics of the solubility pump.
[Tans models the isotopic equilibrium of carbon for an atmosphere fed by three sources: fossil fuel emissions, interactions with the terrestrial biosphere, and the ocean. He has difficulty with terrestrial concentration, and so postulates a delay factor, &tau, in reaching equilibrium. Id., p. 356. He expresses no analogous problem with the ocean, though. He represents dissolved inorganic carbon as a single variable, DIC in the text and Co in equations, and asserts that it comprises "the sum of dissolved CO2, bicarbonate ions, and carbonate ions". Id., p. 355. He should have broken Co into the sum of at least two variables, e.g., Cmolecular + Cionic. This would introduce the missing, analogous oceanic equilibrium problem necessitating an analogous delay, but it would make explicit his tacit assumptions that the distribution between molecular and ionic carbon in the DIC is constant and instantaneous.
[Partitioning DIC into Cmolecular + Cionic allows for the ocean chemistry to interact with Cionic, and the dissolution of atmospheric carbon in the ocean to adjust to Cmolecular. The first is a physical necessity, and the second permits the physics of solubility to operate without adding a novel dependence on ocean chemistry. It divides the ocean carbon reservoir in two, adding a molecular CO2 reservoir to instantaneously adjust to atmospheric CO2 pressure, and to supply ions to ocean chemistry at the pace of thermodynamic equilibration.
[Tans model has the effect of tying solubility to ocean chemistry, an error repeated in the IPCC Reports.
[Tans conclusion is
[The apparent disagreement between the surface disequilibrium method and the oceanic inventory method as well as substantial uncertainties in the application of both methods themselves preclude at this time any firm conclusions on bounds set by the oceanic isotope data on the ocean uptake of CO2. Id., p. 367.
[In addition to Tans' speculation about a missing process, he restates his conclusion in the abstract and in the main body of his paper:
[Recently published δ;13C isotopic data of total inorganic carbon in the oceans (Quay et al., 1992) appear to lead to incompatible results with respect to the uptake of fossil fuel CO2 by the oceans if two different approaches to the data are taken. Consideration of the air-sea isotopic disequilibrium leads to an uptake estimate of only a few tenths of a gigaton C (Gt, for 1015 g) per year, whereas the apparent change in the ocean δ;13C inventory leads to an estimate of more than 2 Gt C yr-1. Both results are very uncertain with presently available data. Bold added, id., Abstract.
[The apparent disagreement between the surface disequilibrium method and the oceanic inventory method as well as substantial uncertainties in the application of both methods themselves preclude at this time any firm conclusions on bounds set by the oceanic isotope data on the ocean uptake of CO2. Bold added, id., p. 367.
[Tans et al doesn't just fail to support the IPCC's reliance on his paper, but asserts that isotopic ratio analysis is not ready to support anything.
[The suggestion that a CO2 transfer process might have been overlooked is manifest. It is the oceanic thermohaline circulation, dominantly absorbing CO2 at the poles and exhausting it in Equatorial waters. This phenomenon is all but ignored by the Consensus.
[Tans et al repeat two IPCC errors, both evident in Tans' Figure 1, p. 354. First, both allows for different flux rates for total carbon and heavy carbon, necessarily implying the novel phenomenon that CO2 solubility is isotopic dependent. Secondly, both introduce novel physics by making solubility dependent on oceanic chemical processes.
[Tans et al, the IPCC's sole, freely available authority, refutes the claim for which it was cited. While nothing invalidates the measured decline in the isotopic ratio of atmospheric CO2 at some sites, the source of lighter CO2 is open to speculation. With nothing more, the phenomenon cannot support the claim that the change in atmospheric CO2 concentration is due to man.
[WATCH THIS SPOT FOR MORE IN PREPARATION ON ISOTOPIC MEASUREMENTS AND THEIR ORIGIN.]
Posted by Ianric Ivarsson | August 4, 2007 8:02 AM
I am pleased to have found your article and have been thinking along similar lines.
It seems to me that over-laid on the long term 1073 year lag you have identified there are other shorter term lags. The Humboldt Current is a huge shallow system which must act as a conveyor belt and would be expected to have a period of weeks or months.
The seasonal variations in the Hawaii Numbers and also NIWA numbers off Dunedin New Zealand appear to show an 8 month lag with CO2 following temperature change.
I have been pulling together numbers on the total sources of world carbon and was astonished to find that if the total known world reserves of fossil fuels (a bit over 1000Pg) was released into the system, the carbon stocks in the biosphere (90% in water) would increase by about 2.5%. Thats not going to make headlines in the world press.
I also found out that there has been some heavy duty sequestering going on over the last 500 million years and that already 99.3% of all world carbon (6,132,000 Pg) is permanently locked up in Calcite deposits (limestone). At historic deposition rates there will be no carbon left in 1.5 million years. Now there is something the world press could get excite about, the extinction of life on earth! Despite this, some people want to seed the oceans with iron to increase the deposition rate.
I am keen to contribute to this debate and look forward to your comments.
JMcK
New Zealand
[RSJ: 10/24/07. Interesting conjectures. Are you sure that the lockup of CO2 in Calcite is permanent? Does subduction carry the Calcite into the melt of magma to be released in volcanoes? What else might be the source of CO2 from volcanoes?
[And considering volcanoes, Earth is likely to experience many super volcano eruptions in the next 1.5 million years. Yellowstone alone erupts about ever 600,000 years and the next one is geologically imminent. Those events may cause a mass extinction and radically alter the composition of the atmosphere.
[We live in a most benign era.]
Posted by Jim McKinlay BSc MBA | August 9, 2007 10:37 PM
Dr. Glassman's theory does a good job of explaining the lag of CO2 in the ice core data and acquits CO2 for that period. However, it does not deal adequately with the post Industrial Revolution (Post IR) period (1770 to date). In Post IR we know humans have increased atmospheric CO2, and atmospheric CO2 is at a higher level than any ice core data shows. (I understand the argument that a warmer period may have been missed in the ice cores). Some, but obviously not all of the CO2 humans produce, has been absorbed by the oceans. Comparing the two periods is very useful for analysis. In the Pre-IR period, there was an external cause of increased T (such as solar activity). The oceans were heated and released CO2. When the external cause stopped, the reverse occurred. T dropped, oceans cooled, and CO2 was taken up. Now, however, what was an effect of warming (A-CO2) during the Pre-IR period, is very likely a cause. If humans do not stop increasing atmospheric CO2, it seems likely to increase T (how much, how fast?), warm the oceans and release more CO2. Where will this stop? In the Pre-IR period, the cessation of the external forcing stopped the process, and a cooling period began. In the Post IR period, humans are not stopping the [] release of CO2. The answer that the oceans will take up all the CO2 man produces seems a faith only. At this time the oceans have not done this.
[RSJ: 10/23/07: The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide doesn't deal with the modern era at all beyond showing some errors in the models reported by the IPCC (aka the Consensus). The paper does not attempt to solve the problem of modeling the climate.
[The notion that the post industrial increase in atmospheric CO2 concentration is due to man is false. It is false notwithstanding the fact that the increase is accompanied by a decrease in the isotopic ratio of 13C to 12C, which is expected from the burning of fossil fuel. It is false because this model requires that the solubility of light CO2 be less than the solubility of heavy CO2. A corollary of that problem is that this model treats natural and manmade CO2 as if they could be successfully segregated in the carbon cycle.
[You say that "some, but not all of the CO2 humans produce, has been absorbed by the oceans." That is true, but determinative of nothing. That is because it is equally true of the CO2 outgassed by the oceans and the biosphere. The CO2 from the multiple sources is irreversibly mixed in the atmosphere and distributed throughout the carbon cycle. The 90 to 110 Gigatons of carbon released just by the ocean alone swamps the 6 Gigatons of manmade CO2.
[No evidence exists that the ocean has ever operated per your explanation. It doesn't switch between global outgassing and global absorbing of CO2. The two processes are continuously underway so long as the ocean is substantially liquid. Cold, dense waters at the poles, heavily laden with recently absorbed CO2, descend, pushing the thermohaline circulation. A millennium later, the circulation resurfaces, especially in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific, warmed and under reduced pressure to outgas CO2 according to the physics of solubility. This cycle, ignored in the Consensus' GCMs, would continue even if the slow chemical and vertical circulations (which it does include in the GCMs) didn't exist at all.
[Natural CO2 in the atmosphere increases with great regularity on glacial scales, as revealed by the Vostok data. Not only that, but the process naturally reverses itself. This year, over 90 Gt of C from the ocean is not going to cause a runaway effect. The notion that man's 6 Gt will, even over 10 years, is ludicrous.
[In 1984, James E. Hansen said,
[Thus our calculations indicate that the gap between current climate and the equilibrium climate for current atmospheric composition may grow rapidly in the immediate future, if greenhouse gases continue to increase at or near present rates.
[As this gap grows, is it possible that a point will be reached at which the current climate "jumps" to the equilibrium climate? If exchange between the mixed layer and deeper ocean were reduced greatly, the equilibrium climate could be approached in as little as 10-20 years … . Bold added, Hansen et al., Climate Sensitivity: Analysis of Feedback Mechanisms, Climate Processes and Climate Sensitivity Geophysical Monograph 29, Maurice Ewing Volume 5.
[In 2007, Hansen says,
[Have we already passed a "tipping point" such that it is now impossible to avoid "dangerous" climate change [citation]? In our estimation, we must be close to such a point, but we may not have passed it yet. …
[Continued rapid growth of CO2 emissions and infrastructure for another decade may make attainment of the alternative scenario impractical if not impossible. Bold added, Hansen, J., et al, Dangerous human-made interference with climate: a GISS modelE Study, Atmos. Chem. Phys., 7, 2287-2312, 7/5/07, p. 2306.
[According to this Guru of Anthropogenic Global Warming, we're at "t minus ten years" and holding. We have been for 23 years.
[The climate is warming. The turn around in the warming since the last ice age, or the last glacial epoch, or even the Little Ice Age, is not yet apparent, notwithstanding any distribution of "hottest years on record".
[The Consensus reckons that the current level of CO2 is 379 ppm, which is actually Mauna Loa data. It says that this is "very likely much higher than any time in at least 650 kyr". To the contrary, Siple data show a peak of 390 ppm occurring within the last 140 kyr. For discussion and citations, see On Why Co2 Is Known Not To Have Accumulated in the Atmosphere & What Is Happening with CO2 in the Modern Era, RSJ response to comment of 10/14/07 12:13 PM. Not only has the recent high CO2 level, measured in the plume of the Eastern Equatorial Pacific outgassing, been exceeded within 650 kyr, it was exceeded within the Antarctic CO2 sink within only 140 kyr.
[The political problem is the technical fact that man has had nothing perceptible to do with it. It's a false alarm.]
Posted by JCAA | August 12, 2007 7:27 AM
One of your contributors was commenting about the disappearance of high-resolution plots of the Vostok data. The cited URL links to one I generated, you may link to it or post it if you like.
[[RSJ: The link appears in our April dialog, above. See RSJ response to your post of 4/19/07.]
Posted by Ursus | August 13, 2007 4:38 PM
Dr Glassman
Seems to me that Vostok is a pretty unique place. South magnetic pole, it has recorded the worlds lowest temperature (-67C today), 3500 m elevation but with an atmosphere more like 6000 m. It has extremely low but consistent levels of precipitation. It has probably the lowest level of CO2 of any where on the surface of globe right now and probably always did have.
Is it correct that serious scientists have simply cobbled the Hawaii data onto the end of the Vostok data? What adjustments should be used to covert Vostok into a reasonable a proxy for historic world CO2 levels? It is not obvious to me that a linear adjustment would be sufficient.
JMcK
[RSJ: See IPCC Third Assessment Report, Climate Change 2001, Technical Summary, Figure 10, p. 40 or Figure 3.2, p. 201. You'll find an overlay of South Pole data on Mauna Loa data, undoubtedly due to Keeling. Figure (a). The IPCC gives no hint how or why the two traces agree as well as they do. You'll also find a separate Vostok chart. Figure (d). The coarsest resolution goes back half a billion years. Figure (f). It shows past CO2 concentrations about 20 times as great as today's.
[The IPCC needs the assumption that the CO2 is well-mixed, so it argues that because the lifetime of CO2 in the air is decades to centuries, it must be well mixed. The conclusion does not follow from the premise, and the premise is false. By IPCC's own figures and formula, the lifetime is less than four years.
[An approach to characterizing the global CO2 concentration might start with a model of the global pattern of natural CO2 flow. The seasonal and global temperature dependence could be then added. Now the model would be ready to add the small signal of manmade CO2. The model would be far from linear. It would resemble a seasonally varying, temperature dependent pattern like the prevailing winds.
[All this would make a fine, career enhancing, academic study, but little more. The GCMs and the Consensus have several, much more profound problems.]
Posted by Jim McKinlay | August 14, 2007 11:33 PM
When carbon dioxide is examined via the medium of infra-red spectroscopy, the results seem to indicate that it is, compared to water vapour, a fairly insubstantial "greenhouse gas". Why then is this not more widely noticed, and why does the IPCC and governments around the world insist that cutting CO2 is the way forwards?
[RSJ: The IPCC didn't ignore the spectral properties of greenhouse gases, but it could have put a lot more effort into reporting on the subject. Many others have made such a contribution. See for example Kiehl, J. T. and K. E. Trenberth, Earth's Annual Global Mean Energy Budget, Bull. Am. Met. Soc. 78, 197-208, 1997 for a nice discussion of the importance of the spectral properties of the atmosphere in filtering the incoming solar radiation and retaining the outgoing blackbody radiation. This paper is also the source of the radiation budget that is the heart of the IPCC's radiative forcing paradigm, the method by which the Consensus hoped to solve a knotty thermodynamics problem. Climate Change 2001, Figure 1.2, p. 90.
[A couple of papers by Raymond T. Pierrehumbert, a "lead author" of the IPCC reports, are actually worthwhile and relevant. The first is Lecture 6 of a series of Conceptual Models of the Climate given at Woods Hole Oceanographic Institute beginning 6/18/01. It is titled "Energy Balance Models (How I learned to stop worrying, and taught myself radiative transfer …". He discusses the absorption spectra of greenhouse gases, observing at one point,
[the importance of line spectra in determining atmospheric absorption has the unappealing consequence that one needs a sophisticated treatment of radiative transfer in order to construct properly a model of the climatic energy balance. Id., 75.
[This difficulty may have given weight to the IPCC's decision not to invest too heavily on absorption spectra discussions. For a more extensive discussion of the climate problem, see the on-line text, Pierrehumbert, R. T., Principles of Planetary Climate, 7/31/07, a work in progress.
[An interesting diagram of spectral absorption in greenhouse gases is at http://www.globalwarmingart.com/images/7/7c/Atmospheric_Transmission.png. Be wary, though, because the spectra are smoothed and normalized, and presumably are at constant and unspecified temperature and humidity. Nevertheless, this diagram serves to show that the absorption of water vapor leaves a couple of windows, one open and one ajar, where CO2 has absorption bands. It is here that CO2 can contribute to the greenhouse theory.
[The water vapor windows not only admit CO2 to the greenhouse gas effect, but together produce an opening for the IPCC's AGW conjecture. Its story begins with the growth in atmospheric CO2 concentration reported by Keeling, coincident with increasing fossil fuel emissions and with a global warming trend. Invoking the century-old greenhouse gas model along with the spectral window opportunities, the Consensus postulates that the CO2 must be the cause of the warming. QED.
[Of course, that's not the end of the AGW story, but it's the end of the absorption spectra part. The window is open for the GCMs.]
Posted by Nick | August 23, 2007 10:39 AM
Perhaps Dr Glassman would enlighten us as to which peer reviewed scientific journals he submitted his paper to. If it was rejected, he should have received reasons by the reviewers of his paper. He should inform us as to what these reviews said. If he has not submitted his paper to the normal scrutiny of the scientific method, he should say why. Telling us that "submitting The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide to one of these refereed journals is a major waste of time" is a cop out. If the MMCC
[RSJ: MMCC ~ man made climate change, and here Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW).]
theory is wrong, only by rigorous application of the scientific method and submitting research to the scrutiny of the peer review process will change it. By not doing this, Dr Glassman places himself in the same category as "Creation Science" (an oxymoron if ever there was one) and conspiracy theorists, no doubt getting a dedicated audience but ultimately having zero impact on the direction of scientific agenda. I realise the population at large loves a science maverick, but in reality very few mavericks have changed the direction of science. Galileo, Newton and their contemporaries established what we would recognise as the modern scientific method to ensure science progressed in as rational and objective way as humanly possible. Einstein, Darwin all operated within the established framework. All the science and technologies we take for granted that sustain the modern world happened this way. Where revolutionaries have changed science (Copernicus, Galileo, Newton, Darwin, Einstein) they take it further away from the "common sense" experience of the population at large, not closer to it. In Climate Change science we don't appear to need a scientific revolution such as spurred on Galileo, Darwin and Einstein: the current scientific state of the art is perfectly adequate to explain what we now observe: applying the knowledge to highly complex, chaotic systems is the problem.
However, Dr Glassman fails to explain why the observed 30% rise in CO2 since 1750 doesn't retain the heat the accepted science since Arrhenius says it must. Interglacial lags (which IPCC AR4 goes a long way to explaining in a way consistent with MMCC) are actually irrelevant in that context as JCAA points out. However, if he's that sure of his case, only by submitting it to professional scrutiny will we know if it's at all sound; playing to the sceptic gallery won't, I'm afraid.
[RSJ: Thanks for contributing to the on-line peer review. The lofty comparisons are a bit over-the-top, though. Rene Descartes' reference to a "major waste of time" is found in the 3/22/07 RSJ response to why the work on this blog has not been submitted to a peer review journal.
[But for the IPCC (aka the Consensus), there would be no global warming problem. The IPCC reports are public, addressed to "policymakers", and they are not a product of peer review. RealClimate.org, the defender of the AGW conjecture, is a blog, and not subjected to any independent peer review panel. Greenpeace and its black list of AGW critics, exxonsecrets.org, are not peer reviewed, academic, operations. The Kyoto Protocol is neither peer reviewed nor academic. These are not "cop outs", but a political movement for power and control in the guise of science. Policymakers respond with laws, not peer-reviewed journal papers.
[The unsymmetrical mantra of "not peer reviewed" is indistinguishable from its cousin, the ad hominem attack. Neither has merit.
[Rene Descartes, like the Consensus, doesn't realize that a rise in CO2 would cause the climate to warm, per Arrhenius and Fourier, all other things being equal. All other things are far from equal in the climate.
[For further enlightenment, watch for a paper soon to be published here that presents a new climate model, one that accounts for the failure of greenhouse gases to warm as predicted by the Consensus.]
Posted by Rene Descartes | August 25, 2007 12:24 PM
Greenhouse Warming? What Greenhouse Warming? Written by Christopher Mon[c]kton, 3rd Viscount Monkton of Brenchley, Wednesday, 22 August 2007
http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/monckton_papers/greenhouse_warming_what_greenhouse_warming_.html
I posted this because you mentioned that soon you will post a paper. Covering a similar angle on the topic.
"[For further enlightenment, watch for a paper soon to be published here that presents a new climate model, one that accounts for the failure of greenhouse gases to warm as predicted by the Consensus.]".
At any rate it is an interesting paper.
Cheers
[RSJ: 10/4/07. Lord Monckton correctly points out a problem that the IPCC (aka the Consensus on Climate) climate models regionally don't match observations. This does seem to be admitted by the Consensus. Monckton legitimately takes this inconsistency to the point of invalidating the models, something the Consensus is sure to reject.
[However in reaching his conclusion, Monckton overlooks several other, higher order problems.
[First what might be called a matter of scale is that global warming by its very name is a thermodynamic problem. It deals with the hypothetical concepts of a global average solar radiation and a global average surface temperature, two parameters which don't exist in the real world to be measured. Just consider, for example, the diurnal (day night) and surface elevation problems. The values of these parameters must be inferred. At the next level, and all but overlooked by the Consensus, is the global average albedo. It, too, is impossible to measure directly, and the Consensus has failed to emulate it dynamically in its GCMs.
[The GCMs are a simulation experiment, so far unsuccessful, to assess the thermodynamic problem with a vast network of adjusted weather models, predominantly simplified to represent mostly radiation, real or equivalent. The problem Monckton addresses is a specific, regional problem in this once noble exercise. He notes,
if we considered only global temperatures, as many climatologists do, this signature of anthropogenic as distinct from natural warming would not become visible. Accordingly, the objections of Essex and McKitrick (2002) and Essex et al. (2007) to the use of globally averaged temperature are justifiable.
[Considered on the appropriate scale, both sides are correct.
[Next Monckton summarizes six causes postulated by the Consensus to account for the particular zonal temperature patterns:
[(a) natural radiative forcing from changes in solar activity;
[(b) natural radiative forcing from changes in volcanic activity;
[(c) anthropogenic radiative forcing from emissions of CO2 and other well-mixed greenhouse gases;
[(d) anthropogenic radiative forcing from changes in tropospheric and stratospheric ozone;
[(e) anthropogenic radiative forcing from pollutant sulphate aerosol particles emitted to the atmosphere; and
[(f) all natural and anthropogenic forcings combined.
[This set of causes omits the profound, natural effect of albedo variations, especially the negative feedback due to cloud albedo. As bad as GCMs might be at representing regional temperature distributions, the thing they do least well is to model clouds, all as admitted by the Consensus. Moreover, what has yet to be published is that the Consensus does not understand feedback, and does not model it correctly.
[Next, the set of causes omits the natural emissions of CO2. These are 30 times as great as the anthropogenic emissions it does include. The natural emissions from the ocean dominate the paleo record, and are 16 times as great as the ACO2. See The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide.
[The atmospheric CO2 is not well-mixed. The presumption that atmospheric CO2 is long-lived, which gives rise to the well-mixed conclusion, is false.
[The Consensus' GCMs model the atmosphere on the margin. The climate in this representation has a large, unstable, natural component and a small, anthropogenic disturbance. Of course, the natural world cannot be unstable, and the anthropogenic forcings cannot be simple add-ons, especially so under the well-mixed conjecture. Moreover, the GCMs do not model the natural world with a warming component. The natural world was (before man, that is) always either warming or cooling. Consequently the natural warming trends since the last ice age, since the last glacial epoch, and since the Little Ice Age, which almost exclusively were natural, are in the GCM models attributed to the anthropogenic forcings. The GCMs are highly flawed, and far from being validated as Monckton recently witnessed, hence to be theories on which to base public policy, are mere conjectures on which one might someday build a theory.]
Posted by Sunsettommy | August 30, 2007 6:52 PM
I've very carefully read this series. I now use it as part of talking to my students about the scientific method, graphing, statistical treatment of data, chartmanship, and peer review. I agree with what you say. It seems to me now that we must disengage ourselves from the tar baby that is CO2 and start working on the real problem. Our generation of waste heat. At my best estimate (on the conservative side)40% of the energy we use we convert to waste heat. It may not truly effect the Earth's climate, but it is energy we are just throwing away. The more I become involved in this debate the more I want to return my Ph.D.
[RSJ:10/4/07. Most encouraging! You have perceived the underlying problem with the AGW crisis: it fails as an exercise in science.
[Our generation of waste heat is a problem in economics. That is not a lesson from Economics Departments, but the sometimes curricula of Engineering Schools. I calculated once that the total energy used by man was one 24,000th of the energy collected from the Sun. Just the known variations in solar radiation, negligible with respect to the climate, swamp what man uses, much less what he wastes.
[I'd like to see your curriculum include the theories of interest and present value, plus probability and risk. Then you'd have a rather full set of tools to understand the waste heat problem. It might be too much for a single course in college chemistry, but these concepts should be taught in K-12 anyway.
[You're Philosophiae Doctor program I'd wager belied its name, containing nothing explicit about the philosophy of science. That seems to be taught nowhere, except incorrectly in philosophy departments, as with Popper, Feyerabend, etc. You might acquire it by osmosis, but that's OK, too. Don't return your PhD -- just enjoy that it led to the philosophy.
[Thanks for the link to the RSJ. (See http://www.chem.tamu.edu/class/fyp/stone/.)]
Posted by Earle Stone | September 6, 2007 6:24 AM
Sir, a more general question about Vostok if I may.
The most prominent feature of an ice core record is its "leaning sawtooth" pattern, a rapid rise followed by a gradual fall, repeatedly, even in the tinier blips. This does not conform to a solar irradiance kind of cycle, which would look more like a symmetrical sine wave.
This is a mystery to me. My only guess is that something like a "cat out of the bag" scenario is at play and that the ocean is the "bag." When you look at the temperature profile, you're actually looking at oxygen and deuterium counts, so it's really no different than the CO2 profile, since both consist of captured elements. Assuming that the ocean is the major repository for elements of all kinds, then, I imagine this:
You've got a bucket full of gas-saturated water that you bring into a room. You close the door and turn up the heat in that room. The water warms, releasing its gases. Now those gases are floating around everywhere. Turn the thermostat down. The water cools, re-absorbing the gases. But here's the thing. It's going to take longer for the bucket to absorb those gases than it took to release them. Warming up, it dumped them into a large volume of air. As the water cools down, these distant wanderers have to make contact with the bucket again to get sucked in.
Putting the cat back in the bag takes time - which gives you a leaning sawtooth pattern, rapid gas rise in the air, gradual decline. Even if the water cools down at the same rate as it warms up, the atmosphere's gas contents won't follow a similar schedule. I suspect that something like this is going on and that actual temperature cycles are more symmetrical and their peak and valley periods are different than element counts in ice cores indicate.
Is this a valid interpretation do you think?
Alan Siddons
PS: This recent article might interest you
http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/carbon_dioxide_the_houdini_of_gases/
[RSJ:10/4/07, rev. 4/16/08. You're gas-saturated water in a room is not too far off the mark, considering the thermohaline circulation. Sea water returning on the surface from its outgassing sites, cools and absorbs increasing amounts of CO2 on its routes to the poles. There, nearly in equilibrium with ice, it absorbs the last of the CO2, and plunges to depths. After a millennium or so, it surfaces at the Equator, at reduced pressure (relative to the depths) and increased temperature. This is the surface solubility pump, and it would account for part of your model. But that is a continuing process at most any global temperature (until the oceans freeze), and doesn't account for the sawtooth pattern.
[You conjecture that the absorption takes longer than outgassing. But that's in the context of the global temperature, and not the solubility pump. I am unaware of any such physics model that would account for differing rates.
[You have highlighted an important feature for the GCMs to replicate. Whatever might account for the glacial epochs, the unsymmetrical cooling and warming must be represented. Three possibly related phenomena appear to be involved -- switching of ocean circulations, changes in total albedo, and changes in atmospheric water vapor concentration. None of these is obviously a cause for asymmetric temperature change, and none of them is sufficient to cause the entry to and exit from the ice ball state. An external source is needed, and the best yet advanced are the Milankovitch cycles. Still, not all the climate changes that Milankovitch cycles would predict are evident, nor can they account for the ice ages.
[Read more at http://www.lakepowell.net/sciencecenter/paleoclimate.htm. This may prove to be a jewel of a site -- a breath of fresh air devoid of CO2, of anthropogenics, and of greenhouses, but rich in science. A "global warming" is but a candidate for a future exhibit.
[Skepticism is to science as ashes are to the Phoenix.]
Posted by Alan Siddons | September 12, 2007 10:45 PM
Hi Jeffrey,
Thanks for this. When I first starting looking into the 'War on Weather' a little over a year ago, I was surprised to find that the most widely quoted values for atmospheric CO2 concentrations were taken from an observatory on the flank of one of the world's largest volcanoes. Like most other volcanoes Mauna Loa in the natural course of things intermittently emits CO2, and this odd choice of a potentially severely contaminated sampling site must have presented Keeling and co-workers right at the start of their work with a big problem of local contamination. I don't know how they overcame it, but the widely-published curve of ever-increasing CO2 at Mauna Loa is certainly impressive.
I'd like to see data of modern CO2 concentrations in air from other sites, especially from Vostok or elsewhere in Antarctica. Can you suggest where I could obtain such data?
Cheers,
Hugo
[RSJ: 10/4/07. Sorry, no. I'm constantly on the alert for such data. The data that are available are shrouded in secrecy.
[First, much of what Charles Keeling has produced is for sale only. Second, if you navigate to a website with raw data, you'll find files too large to be downloaded to a personal computer. The data that are available have been have been subjected to smoothing, correcting, baseline shifting, and special calibrating. I have yet to find potentially key data like wind parameters and temperature.
[Though I cannot offer proof, my feelings are that Charles Keeling, et al. did account for volcanic emissions, but did not account for Pacific outgassing. The investigators report on calibration applied to account for differences between reduction of identical samples by different sites. My fear is that a similar technique may have been applied to make data from different sites support climatologists' well-mixed assumption. I understand that the Mauna Loa data may have been corrected for El Niño events. Were they corrected for other events?
[These problems are most unsettling, but not critical. The Consensus is so far off base on a number of other issues that data sharing doesn't matter.]
Posted by Hugo | September 26, 2007 10:19 AM
Hello Jeff,
National Geographic Magazine has stepped into the global warming debate. Actually the way they present the information in their October issue there is no debate just a foregone conclusion. A very simple argument is presented: Atmospheric CO2 used to measure 280 ppm and has increased since the industrial revolution to today's level of 380 ppm. They state that human activity accounts for 80% of the increase. Yet I have seen data that the human caused portion of CO2 is very small. I realize from your paper that the argument is much more complicated but the problem with a simplistic argument presented in National Geo is that it is easy to comprehend and unless rebutted, will gain believers. Do you have any comments?
Regards,
Bob Knowles
[RSJ: I saw the same article. This simple theme pops up from time to time. As we both know from experience, the shorter the answer must be, or the more naive the audience, to a complex question the more difficult (and risky) the answer.
[1. Check figure 3.2 from the IPCC (the U.N.'s Nobel Prize Winning Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change and the voice of the Consensus on Climate) Third Assessment Report. Figure 3.2b supports your question. But Figure 3.2f shows perhaps just over half of the studies on Earth's CO2 concentration, each at a different time period, with momentously more CO2 than at the present. About 11 of those studies show CO2 as high as 10 times the present, and four studies are 20 times as high. Here's a link to the figure:
[http://www.grida.no/climate/ipcc_tar/wg1/fig3-2.htm
[(Background: The data pose a problem with respect to validity not addressed in your question. The Consensus blends data from remarkably different sources without justification. Sometimes the instruments differ, often the location differs, sometimes the data are inferred from surrogate measurements like plant growth. The IPCC doesn't report what the data bands (e.g., 4500-6000 ppm) mean that represent the studies. Are these supposed to be the range over which the concentration varied during the period, are they error bands for the method, or both?
[(The Mauna Loa and South Pole data, Figure 3.2a and called the Keeling Curve, are made to overlay by smoothing and calibration using methods not publicly available. The result is in disagreement with the physics of the ocean and atmosphere, i.e., the CO2 gradients. The Consensus relies on the well-mixed assumption for two reasons: to blend data from different locations and to support its conjecture that anthropogenic CO2 accumulates in the atmosphere. That conjecture is essential to its catastrophe prediction, but the accumulation, too, is contrary to the physics of the two fluids.)
[2. The Consensus data on CO2 flux has the oceans exchanging about 90 GtC/yr, land about 120 GtC/yr, and leaf water another 270 GtC/yr not always included in the Consensus's budget. That's a total of 480 GtC/yr. Man adds as much as 6 GtC/yr, about 1.3% to 3%, through fossil fuel burning and indirectly through deforestation The total atmospheric CO2 is around 750 Gt, so it is replaced in about 1.5 years, not centuries. The Consensus models the climate as being in equilibrium (but unstable), except for man's (destabilizing) contribution. As a result, it has the natural flux in sweet, delicate balance, and the manmade CO2 building to dangerous levels. It has no physical basis for different physics of absorption of the two species of CO2. The Consensus models the two gases as if they were transported around the globe in separate pipes. See IPCC Fourth Assessment Report, p. 515, Figure 7.3. Instead, the two species of CO2 are irreversibly mixed in both the atmosphere and the ocean.
[(Background: CO2 from fossil fuel has a slightly different isotopic composition than background or natural CO2 for the same reason that carbon dating works. Some species of plants favor one isotope of carbon over another, but that is not near enough to account for the implied difference in physics of absorption.
[Rev. 10/15/07. (Because of the seasonal fluctuations in David Keeling's data, and because of his faith in Anthropogenic Global Warming, he conjectured that his measurements reflected processes on the continents. Subsequently he and others supported this theory by measurements showing that the CO2 at Mauna Loa had a somewhat low molecular weight, 14C absent and 13C depleted. Instead, Mauna Loa sits in the chimney of CO2 outgassing from the Eastern Equatorial Pacific. See the IPCC Fourth Assessment Report, p. 523, Figure 7.8, pdf only; not yet available as a webpage. The resulting CO2 rich air is carried aloft in what are called Hadley Cells, which then descend at about 10º-20º latitude, feed into the trade winds, and thence across Hawaii. Much of the Mauna Loa CO2 is about a thousand years old, absorbed at the poles and carried to the Equator by the Great Conveyor Belt, the thermohaline circulation.)
[3. You didn't mention warming. Global warming is on-going since the last ice age, since the last glacial epoch, and since the Little Ice Age, and though we are nearing a local maximum on a geological scale, no turn around is yet visible on any scale. We also can prove that warming produces more CO2. Of course, they're correlated! The Consensus just has cause & effect reversed in its model.
[The conclusion that either greenhouse gas (for reasons not discussed here) or CO2 is producing runaway global warming is premature, if not a scientific fraud. Piltdown man on 'roids.]
Posted by Robert Knowles | October 12, 2007 12:24 PM
A source of worldwide CO2 data and graphics:
http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/contents.htm
[RSJ: Trends, along with other links from CDIAC, cited and data discussed passim on this blog.]
Posted by Ursus | October 17, 2007 7:22 AM
If the thermohaline circulation/CO2 solubility pump is responsible for the millennial time lag between increasing atmospheric temperature and increasing atmospheric CO2 concentration, as the Vostok ice cores purportedly demonstrate, then wouldn't that require that increasing atmospheric temperature at time T would result in increasing absorption of CO2 into the polar oceans at time T, resulting at time T+millennium in increasing outgassing of CO2 from the equatorial oceans and increasing atmospheric CO2 concentration? If so, how could increasing atmospheric temperature at time T lead to increasing absorption of CO2 into the polar oceans at time T? I would expect the opposite to be true since increasing atmospheric temperature at time T would cause increasing sea surface temperature at time T, resulting in less, not more, absorption of CO2 into the polar oceans at time T, resulting at time T+millennium in decreasing, not increasing, CO2 outgassing from the equatorial oceans and decreasing, not increasing, atmospheric CO2 concentration. Am I missing something? It seems to me to be more likely that there is simply a millennial time lag between atmospheric warming and oceanic warming, such that it takes a millennium for increasing atmospheric temperature to result in increasing oceanic temperature and increasing outgassing of CO2. Incidentally, Jaworowski argues that "proxy ice core reconstructions of the chemical composition of the ancient atmosphere are false", page 4 of this link:
http://www.larouchepub.com/eiw/public/2007/2007_10-19/2007-11/pdf/38_711_science.pdf.
[RSJ: Don't put too much stock in the millennium time lag. One thing the correlation function between CO2 concentration and the temperature anomaly shows clearly is that zero lag is the poorest choice. The millennium lag is one of several possible peaks, suggesting multiple paths in the solubility pump. That would not be an unreasonable model.
[The surface of the ocean and the atmosphere are both warmed by the sun and cooled by radiation into space. The surface waters are limited in temperature rise by contact with deep waters, which are not reached by solar radiation. The atmosphere temperature rise is limited by conduction to the surface waters. The ocean dominates the process because the heat capacity of water is so much greater than that of air. How quickly the exchanges occur depends on relative heat capacity (including humidity), greenhouse gases (including clouds), and winds, among other things. How quickly changes occur is evident from the seasonal (10/29/07: and diurnal) experience, and it is instantaneous compared to the millennia time scale you suggest.
[Your opening hypothetical has a few technical and semantic problems. The solubility of CO2 in water depends primarily on the water temperature, but not the atmospheric temperature. Next a greater water temperature (at any time, T), regardless of whether increasing or decreasing, would result in a lesser, not greater CO2 absorption.
[Stepping over those little problems, the model I suggest for the solubility pump begins with poleward moving, cooling surface waters accumulating CO2. The waters are CO2-saturated, or nearly so, at the poles where the water temperature is fixed because ice is in equilibrium with sea water. Regardless of the global temperature, as long as Earth has ice at the poles the uptake of CO2 is fixed by the solubility curve at the freezing point (and the geometry of the ice caps). For multiple and complex reasons, the cold, CO2-saturated waters feed the thermohaline circulation, descending to depths, undersaturated by higher pressure, for a millennium of process interactions at high pressure. When these waters resurface, they return to atmospheric pressure to outgas at the modern sea surface temperature (SST).
[This model operates all along the solubility curve from the freezing point to the current SST at the regions of outgassing. One would expect the effective average SST to be a reasonable proxy for the global atmospheric temperature, a thermodynamic parameter representing global warming.
[Nothing, not even The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide, dictates the form of the model for atmospheric and oceanic circulations and the mechanism of the solubility exchanges. Many models of varying complexity might provide reasonable or sufficient fits with the data. This is manmade, creative, and the modeler's art. The importance of The Acquittal is that every valid GCM, absent anthropogenic forcings, must reproduce the relationship between CO2 concentration and global temperature, whether represented by valid proxies or otherwise, evident in the ice core data.
[Either that, or postulate an objective criterion to exclude ice core data from the model domain.
[A corollary of this scientific mandate that a hypothesis (or better, a theory or law) must reproduce all the data in its domain is that a valid GCM must hypothesize a solution to the mystery of global warming pre-man, an event or a set of events also consistent with all the data. Without this capability, GCMs will, as they now do, erroneously attribute the background, natural warming to the effects of man.
[But for the IPCC, the voice of the Consensus on Climate, no climate crisis would exist. Since its models for the climate do not satisfy scientific rigor, the impending catastrophe is a false alarm.]
Posted by John Blethen | October 26, 2007 4:23 PM
Any comments on Jawarowski's arguments that "proxy ice core reconstructions of the chemical composition of the ancient atmosphere are false"? If true this would appear to invalidate ice cores as proxies.
[RSJ: In context, your quotation from Jaworowski says,
[Proxy determinations of the atmospheric CO2 level by analysis of ice cores, reported since 1985, have been generally lower than the levels measured recently in the atmosphere. But, before 1985, the ice cores were showing values much higher than the current atmospheric concentrations (Jaworowski et al. 1992b). These recent proxy ice core values remained low during the entire past 650,000 years (Siegenthaler et al. 2005)-even during the six former interglacial warm periods, when the global temperature was as much as 5ºC warmer than in our current interglacial!
[This means that either atmospheric CO2 levels have no discernible influence on climate (which is true), or that the proxy ice core reconstructions of the chemical composition of the ancient atmosphere are false (which is also true, as shown below). Jaworowski, Z., CO2: The Greatest Scientific Scandal of Our Time, EIR Science, 3/16/07, p. 41.
[First, a quibble about Jaworowski's logic. If A is true, then A or B is true even if B is lunacy. Since he claimed that both parts were true anyway, he should have used the conjunctive and instead of the disjunctive or.
[But worse, Jaworowski left out a third branch in his disjunction: (C) the ice core proxy data need recalibrating. He appears to admit C, too, is true when he says,
[The CO2 ice core data are artifacts caused by processes in the ice sheets and in the ice cores, and have concentration values about 30 to 50% lower than in the original atmosphere. Id., p. 42.
[Proxy data by their nature require calibration to a reliable standard, or even intercalibration to make sense of multiple, diverse data streams, especially where no reliable measurement exists. This is exactly what the IPCC has done as shown by its charts and some of its authorities. But care is necessary in drawing conclusions from such calibrated data, which the IPCC ignores.
[The Vostok data acquisition and reduction is a major scientific accomplishment, calibrated correctly or not. The data reveal profound patterns in temperature and CO2 concentration, some obvious and some subtle. Both the temperature anomaly and the CO2 concentrations can be mis-calibrated without disturbing the patterns. The data reveal the glacial epochs of the past 0.7 million years, plus or minus something, in both temperature and CO2 concentration. They reveal that CO2 lagged the temperature by a millennium, plus or minus something else. And as shown on this blog in The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide, the CO2 and temperature relationship is well represented by the solubility of CO2 in water. These results stand, notwithstanding the problems troubling Jaworowski. The ice core data are not, as you wonder, invalidated.
[The IPCC errs to conclude from its mix of data from different sources, which it calibrated into agreement in time or intensity, that modern measurements are unprecedented. The IPCC errs to conclude from its manipulated data that atmospheric CO2 is well-mixed. It also errs to conclude from 420,000 years worth of measurements at an interval of 1.5 millennia that the record of the last 50 years is unprecedented. Notwithstanding calibration errors, the confidence level is only 3%.
[Jaworowski's conclusion that the IPCC handling of data is bad science is true. The 83 year shift to plot Siple ice core data and Mauna Loa data contiguously is enough to arouse a modern high school graduate's suspicions. However, Jarowowski's diagram (Figure (2b)) is an incomplete reconstruction of the IPCC chart (Third Assessment Report, p. 201, Figure 3.2b)). After all, what counts is just what's in the IPCC Reports. The IPCC shows coherence too with Law Dome, Adelle Land, and South Pole data streams. Did the IPCC calibrate each of the traces into agreement? Probably it did, judging by the 83 year shift. Were the time calibrations all the same? Is there a pattern to the necessary calibrations?
[Before any government accepts the IPCC reports as legitimate, the IPCC should be oblliged to make all its data freely available over the Internet in text format. It should also make its entire bibliography similarly available, since it does not quote from its copyrighted sources nor does it cite the origins of its referenced material. A full exercise of the Freedom of Information Act is needed. Let the UN buy the rights to all its references and give them away as a down payment on the $30 trillion it thinks the world should spend for tankage and suppression of a benign and beneficial gas.
[Jaworoski's concern about data calibration is a slip knot in the rope with which to hang the IPCC. Assuming it might ever respond, it could argue its way out of the predicament with calibration excuses. This is analogous to what it did when, after first claiming that Vostok proved that CO2 caused global warming, it learned that the CO2 lagged the temperature. It invented the naked model that while CO2 may not have initiated global warming, it surely amplified it.
[Similarly, since the IPCC and the Consensus on Climate have no capability to reproduce or predict climate, they re-targeted their mission to model climate change. Accuracy in calibration is less demanding in a model for climate change. This is weasel wording, not science.
[Jaworowski's conclusion that the CO2 has had no effect on climate agrees with other analyses. As he observes, large surges in CO2 did not cause a runaway effect. He could say the same thing about the full greenhouse effect. Through ignorance of feedback, a failure to understand stability, and its failure to model the solar wind, clouds and albedo, the IPCC has exaggerated both effects to create a global catastrophe out of whole cloth.
[The Consensus on Climate succumbed to the Delicate Blue Planet model learned in K-3, and failed to appreciate and model Earth's conditionally stable state.]
Posted by John Blethen | October 27, 2007 10:49 AM
Mr. Glassman, thanks for sharing your informed views on these topics. I brought your web site to the attention of a science forum that I visit located at this URL http://forums.hypography.com/environmental-studies/13486-co2-acquittal-2.html
If you wouldn't mind taking a look at some of the responses there, I'd love to read your comments on them. I think this kind of debate is very healthy. As a laymen trying to make sense of it all, these discussions are really helpful to me.
Thanks so much for creating this site.
Paul
P.S. I too am a former Hughes employee. I worked for the Space and Communications group in El Segundo for 6 years until they were bought up by GM. Shortly after that, I moved on.
Thanks again,
Paul
[RSJ: Hypography Science Forums commentary is welcome, and I am happy to pass on the link.
[In the commentary, you correctly observed,
[He welcomes comments to his work on his web site. I will bring up some of the issues that you folks have brought to the table and see how he replies. Perhaps some of you could chime in there as well. He seems to be inviting reasoned rebuttle or questions.
[Maintaining a single blog is tasking. Sometimes I run a month late researching and composing an answer, and I have been experimenting with quicker posts with promises to answer. In this blog I can respond more or less in a threaded, dialog style to minimize the burdensome restatements. More importantly, the objective of this initial topic in the Rocket Scientist's Journal is to build a self-contained, lasting resource of scientific criticism on the Anthropogenic Global Warming model. The policy is to post all civil comments and to reply, regardless of credentials. You post at the risk of minor edits and in extreme cases, ridicule.
[So, please post any comments or discussion to this site for a fair and honest, if slow, reply. Feel free to extract what you might from anywhere. Links are welcome, but please quote what is important so the reader can follow the argument on a single page. The IPCC routinely relies on citations to papers not freely available or not searchable. This is poor scientific writing, unnecessary, and excessively burdensome on the reader. Copyright material is subject to the fair use exclusion by which it may be freely quoted for the purposes of criticism, commentary, or reporting.
[With that said, here are a couple of comments on the postings in the Science Forum.
[Some readers have not recognized that The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide paper analyzes one particular data record, the Vostok ice core data. It is a paleontological record, and so the reader should not expect that the resulting model would have any manmade component. The important new result is the extent to which solubility in water accounts for this ancient record. The analysis has implications for the modern era, of course, because nothing suggests that the science of climate processes changed since Fourier invented the greenhouse model or Keeling his Curve. A massive river of CO2 is flowing around the globe, but just not yet through the GCMs.
[The IPCC GCMs fail to account for the record. They fail to model the circulation of CO2 from the atmosphere to the ocean and return. They fail to model the Great Conveyor Belt (less accurately known as the thermohaline circulation (THC)) as the main engine of CO2.
[The IPCC GCMs fail, too, to account for the ice ages (not in the Vostok record) or the glacial epochs (some of which are in the Vostok record). A scientific model that doesn't account for all the data in its domain is doomed to be a conjecture. The GCMs either need to be restated in such a way as to objectively exclude the known record, or be revised to account for that record, even if the triggering events are unknown. That is to be valid, the GCMs need to produce ice ages and glacial epochs, even if the timing is off.
[Climatologists have put forth an accounting for the Little Ice Age, resulting in controversy and the disparaging Hockey Stick appellation. What the critics say, and this may have support in the IPCC reports, is that instead of having the models reproduce a Little Ice Age-like event, the climatologists calibrated away the whole event! In the same way, the self-proclaimed Consensus on Climate calibrated away the variations in the CO2 record to make it fit the preconceived notion that the Keeling Curve represents global CO2. See RSJ, "Gavin Schmidt's Response to the Acquittal of CO2 Should Sound the Death Knell for AGW", comment from Sunsettommy dated 11/26/07, and posted today.
[As to peer review, this is now the coward's refuge. The peer review process is broken, and nowhere so badly as in this field. Climate journals are under control of the Consensus on Climate, and they have a long record of failing to publish criticism. See RSJ, The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide, response to Jeff Steward, dated 3/22/07. Furthermore, the peer review process is far too slow. DARPA founded the Internet on the need to improve technical communications. Let it be so. Posting a paper on the Internet is publication.
[The observation that the IPCC Reports are not peer reviewed stands as a counterpoint to the claim that its criticism must be peer reviewed. Peer review is never self-review, no matter how many authors might be named. The response that the IPCC Reports make extensive reference to published data and published, peer reviewed papers is to the IPCC's discredit because the organization fails to quote sufficiently from those papers, because the papers are only available for a fee (science for sale), and because the sources often prove unsupportive of the claims. Examples available on request. I look forward to the Freedom of Information Act next year forcing the IPCC to make every citation and data source freely available, on line, and at least Mac accessible. Let the UN pay for any copyright fees.
[Thank you for asking InfinteNow to justify some of his accusatory comments. You missed a few of his excesses. He first quotes from the Abstract, then claims that it "opens the entire presentation". Actually, Part I, Introduction does that. He again quotes from the Abstract to a paper critical of the IPCC results, and points to a link to the IPCC Fourth Assessment Report to show that results of the paper are wrong. He accuses me of "classic denialist tactics", a term he freshly minted without example or definition. He objects to the Introduction stating that the climatologists have been unable to reproduce the ice ages and glacial periods, providing two entirely irrelevant links.
[The question of the presentation of data is not so much graphical as it is substituting eyeball correlation of snippets of smoothed data for numerical calculations (and presentation) of correlation. The problem is one of quantitative signals in noise. It's not a matter of "doesn't this look convincing held this way"?
[InfiniteNow lifts single sentences out of The Acquittal to say they are unsupported. Then he lifts another to say, "It doesn't matter how many times he says the same thing. It's still unsupported and without basis in evidence." He never mentions the Vostok record or the data analysis, though. This is an exquisite example of out-of-context argumentation. It is snide.
[For more on the accumulation of CO2 in the atmosphere, see RSJ, "On Why CO2 Is Known Not To Have Accumulated in the Atmosphere & What Is Happening With CO2 in the Modern Era". You might also be interested in the following recently posted by me in response to comments on another website.
[The IPCC conjectures that ACO2 is buffered more than is nCO2. The laws and theories of solubility have to change one of two ways for that to happen. The primary law, Henry's Law, says that the solubility of a gas in water is proportional to the partial pressure of the gas in the water, and the constant of proportionality, Henry's Coefficient, is inversely proportional to the temperature. This is the physics of the carbonated drink. The climatologists have modified this law legitimately, apparently, by making the coefficient also slightly sensitive to salinity (at least a hypothesis, perhaps a theory).
[The IPCC needs Henry's Coefficient to be different for ACO2 than it is for nCO2. Furthermore, it wants the coefficient to be dependent on the concentration of certain ions in the water so as to create a buffering effect. These could be so, but they are just more conjectures. As it stands, the IPCC model that any kind of CO2 is buffered by the ocean requires a change to pretty well-known physics.
[As a part of the IPCC version of ocean chemistry, it shows three models for processes called pumps or carbon pumps in Figure 7.10, Fourth Assessment Report, page 530. http://ipcc-wg1.ucar.edu/wg1/wg1-figures.html, page 11. These three pumps, the "solution pump", the "organic carbon pump", and the "CaCO3 counter pump" are likely to be the quick, the medium, and the slow speed absorption models, respectively. The first has a time constant of one to a few years, and the latter takes 35,000 years to make rocks.
[One of these is not chemical. It is the Solubility Pump, which the IPCC calls the "solution pump". This is the mechanism by which CO2 enters the water to create a reservoir of molecular CO2. It circulates around the globe in the Great Conveyor Belt where CO2 is absorbed as the ocean cools and moves poleward, and CO2 is outgassed primarily in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific. This outgassing is about 16 times as great as ACO2 emissions, according to the IPCC. The Conveyor Belt and the pool of molecular CO2 are omitted from Figure 7.10.
[The IPCC calls the Conveyor Belt the thermohaline circulation (THC). The name Conveyor Belt doesn't sound so scientific, but it's probably a better name. The name THC emphasizes the flow of heat and salt, important but overlooking the crucial CO2 circulation. Many of the IPCC's Global Climate Models represent a vertical column of radiative forcing stuff and have no provisions for lateral flow, which is where almost all of the CO2 circulation occurs.
[The other two pumps, the Organic Carbon Pump and the CaCO3 Counter Pump, are chemical processes. A minor error in Figure 7.10 has the flow of carbon to the atmosphere connected backwards for the CaCO2 Counter Pump. Regardless, the chemical processes are quite unlikely to react with atmospheric, molecular CO2! Chemical pumps need to access ions. A better conjecture is that the models should be connected instead to a reservoir of molecular CO2 in the water, fed by the solubility pump, and the place where ionization first occurs. In this version, the conjectured pool of molecular CO2 is a buffer that supports the solubility pump and feeds the other two pumps so that all three pumps can operate without interfering with (buffering) one another. This model challenges the notion that ocean chemistry buffers against the dissolution of CO2 in water.]
Posted by Paul | November 28, 2007 11:30 AM
At the urging of my students I reluctantly (not looking forward to the attention from the atmospheric sciences department) put together a talk based off of what I have been able to learn and decipher over the last 4 months. I did not after 4 months of study claim to be an expert, but I did state that I believe myself to be an informed scientific skeptic. I did not get four slides into the talk before an associate professor in the atmospheric sciences department told me to stop speaking; I could not say these things to students; they must enroll in the course being heavily advertised in the school paper. (I ask what other department has the money to advertise an undergraduate course?) It was not my facts, he said that were wrong, but my tone and context that were. I could not, should not doubt the considered judgment of the IPCC.
All I had said was
1) that the planet was warming
2) that NASA has determined that Mars and Triton are warming and the causes could in part and quite likely be in whole the same.
3) that the polar ice caps on the Earth had increased by 1 million square kilometers when comparing satellite images taken in 1986 and 2006
4) that IR absorptions for individual absorbers are not linearly additive, that altitude, latitude, longitude and a host of other factors must be considered, and that IR absorptions are logarithmic not arithmetic.
5) That the considered opinion of Reid Bryson was that within the first 30 meters of the atmosphere that water was one thousandth as important as water. The students asked him to leave so I could finish my talk. (This is the point where he went off) Sad.
I never got to the point that the numbers show that man is currently contributing 0.28% of the GHG emissions of which approximately half is CO2.
I really wanted to engage him in a discussion. I wanted to know how he and the consensus scientists account for atmospheric water. I wanted to know how he accounted for the heat capacity of water. I wanted to discuss and come to know a lot of the issues I am still educating myself on.
I did not expect them to harass the student who put on the talk or send me emails stating that I needed to take their class. I did not expect to be a topic of discussion for another member of the atmospheric science's department during his class and to be so roundly disparaged. I find this last out from the hostess at a favorite restaurant taking a low level class for non science majors.
Heretic or skeptic, denier or blasphemer; I am glad that none are put in jail or burned at the stake anymore. My presentation, without all my supplemental comments is on my website. It needs a lot of work, but I have not had years to polish my presentation. I will however if asked present it again.
Thanks for the comment on waste heat. It is indeed just that, wasteful. We can from an engineering point do better. Even our waste heat is inconsequential in the scheme of solar irradiation.
4 of my returning students next semester are meteorology majors. Should be interesting.
[RSJ: The true hazard of Global Warming: getting burned by a colleague. The main cause of warming appears to be friction between believers and skeptics.
[Shame on the Associate Professor for interrupting your lecture. Common courtesy if not professional courtesy requires that he bring his concerns to your attention in private.
[I assume from your description of the event that the Associate Professor was not just defending his department's economic interest in its rice bowl, but instead was trying to control information given to students. That is indoctrination, not teaching, and that, too, is to his deep discredit.
[The Associate Professor's action suggests yet another defect in his makeup: he is a believer in a scientific model. He needs some training himself in the principles of science and therefore how to teach science. It is about models of the real world with predictive power. It is not about belief systems. Science is the objective branch of knowledge; it is not about the false attributes of explanation and description, for they are subjective. Nothing is wrong with a scientist having beliefs -- that would be unavoidable. What is wrong is a scientist's failure to separate his beliefs from his science, or even science in general.
[I would also quibble with your claim to be a scientific skeptic only because it is redundant. An essential virtue in a scientist is skepticism. As this applies to the Associate Professor, he should have welcomed all expressions of skepticism, especially yours, as challenges to his model of the real world. Scientific models only advance to theories to the extent they can be validated, and responding to skepticism is a start.
[He should have raised his hand and the end of your lecture to thank you for a most interesting talk. He should have expressed his general disagreement, and invited the students to enroll in his department's class for what he considers better considered viewpoints.
[As an aside, my model for the optimum university emphasizes debate, not lecture. This is the How To Think University, not the What To Think Academy. Proponents of views should be obliged alternatively to defend their views, if they happen to have been revealed, and those of the opposition with equal proficiency. Earned debate points would out rank subject matter proficiency for advancement. The catch here is to create debatable topics, and that's hard to do with algebra and plate tectonics. It's not so hard with evolution, global warming, and the philosophy and ethics of science.
[Just as I don't like belief systems, I'm not a fan of expert opinions, even Reid Bryson's. Give him credit instead for the model his has built, the results it has achieved, and the reasoning behind it. In the end, though, there would be no climate crisis but for the IPCC, and the only way to defeat that movement successfully is to debunk its modeling. Alternative theories just won't do. The predictions of all models are on the climate scale, a lifetime in the future. So alternative models will be weighed against the Consensus models according the number of hands raised.
[You said "water was one thousandth as important as water", surely intending carbon dioxide to be one thousandth as important as water. [On review of your slides, Bryson's units are feet, not meters.] The number is unimportant and somewhat debatable. The transcendent problem with this observation is that it is in the context of a particular model for climate: the greenhouse effect, which is actually the open-loop greenhouse effect.
[I submit that Earth resides in conditionally stable states, not to be upset by a slug of greenhouse gas and its alleged positive feedbacks. It is not well-modeled as a "Delicate Blue Planet" with "tipping points" accessible to man. Fourth Assessment Report (4AR), Box 10.1, p. 775; see also Third Assessment Report (TAR), ¶7.1, p. 421.
[Instead, the surface temperature is controlled by the negative feedback of cloud albedo. This is not even recognized, let alone modeled, by the IPCC. The Consensus on Climate discusses feedback extensively, but in the end doesn't even understand the concept. Except for accidental feedback in its radiative forcing GCMs, its feedback loops consist of correlation vectors between elements of the climate. Compare its diagrams of feedback loops, TAR, Figures 7.4, 7.6-7.8, pp. 439-454, with any text on feedback control systems. The IPCC's GCMs cannot model clouds, and so it models albedo as a constant. It does not and cannot close the loop between warming and increased cloud and cloud albedo.
[If asked to compute the closed loop gain, the IPCC would be at a loss. With an albedo sensitivity to temperature too small to be detected in the current state of the art, the greenhouse effect may be reduced from the levels predicted by the IPCC by an order of magnitude.
[Consequently, fine tuning the contributions of greenhouse gases to global warming is waste heat in the unmasking of the IPCC.
[You won't be burned at the stake, but your career will be unless we put out the fire. A well-balanced debunking on the other hand has genuine career promise.
[Except for one insertion, the comments above are without the benefit of your presentation. It can be found at http://www.authorstream.com/Presentation/nemostone-32224-Presentation-TAMU-Geosciences-Students-Globa-Slide-1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12-13-14-15-16-17-18-19-20-21-22-23-24-25-26-27-Earle-Stone-Dept-Ch-global-ppt-powerpoint/. Here is a full response to your slides. I hope it is helpful.
[Slide 2: compares climate changes on Mars and Triton to Earth. Climate modeling by analogy is doomed to be a conjecture. Earth's climate is primarily a thin byproduct of our unique, liquid phase oceans, significant in the ratios of their heat capacities. We are more likely to be visited by a life-snuffing calamity, internal or external (but natural), before we confirm the existence of another Class M planet.
[Slide 3: sea ice changes in 20 years. Scientific models are notoriously scale dependent, from thermodynamic, unmeasurable, conceptual macroparameters down to microparameters for chemical reactions and cloud formation. In the middle are the human sensible parameters like those of weather. Global warming is a thermodynamic, macroparameter problem involving global parameters that cannot be directly measured, especially the global mean surface temperature (GMST), and the global mean albedo. If you were to picture Earth's climate (i.e., GMST) on a single slide for most of its existence, you would see that the climate has yet to turn around from the warming from the last ice age 2 Myrs ago. If you did the same thing for the period covering the Vostok record, Earth is still warming from the last glacial epoch 20,000 years ago. A graph for the 2000 year period of the Christian calendar shows Earth warming since the Little Ice Age (erased by the IPCC) about 200 years ago. Viewed on these scales, yes, Virginia, the climate is warming. Ice pack changes over 20 years seem like a weather phenomenon or a minor trend. Does the ice pack breathe in and out as the ozone hole might? Can we extrapolate from sea ice to total ice?
[Slides 4-6: infrared spectra. Infrared spectra are sure important, especially if the greenhouse effect is! But the greenhouse effect is held in check, and the spectra are not macroparameters. A net global effective irradiance, absorption, and albedo (i.e., the Bond albedo) should suffice to swamp spectral fine structure considerations. CO2 is not "evenly distributed". That is a major assumption of the IPCC so that it can interpret Mauna Loa data as global. A massive river of CO2 circles the globe, 16 times as great as ACO2, beginning mainly in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific, laying down a plume across Mauna Loa, and gradually working its way along mean atmospheric circulation patterns, dispersing while being reabsorbed by the cooler ocean, descending to depths at the poles for a millennium journey back to the Eastern Equatorial Pacific. The IPCC puts the latitudinal gradient at 10 ppm, but, alas, with no ratio units such as "per degree" or "per 90 degrees".
[Slides 7 & 8: two decades of tropospheric and stratospheric temperature anomalies. The parameter of interest lies at the bottom of the troposphere. Don't the stratospheric measurements show the featured upper atmosphere is irrelevant?
[Slide 9: ten hottest and ten coldest years and the GISS surface temperature graph. Weather is the noise of climate. It's difficult to get excited about warm seasons, or the number of hot or cold days in some period. Such considerations distract the lay person from the climate problem. They should be pooh-poohed. The full graph, though, is an objective start at making climate estimates out of weather measurements. What is the outlier datum around 2100?
[Slide 11: greenhouse gas proportions. Good chart to show IPCC's gamesmanship in pushing aside water vapor. Where does condensed water vapor, i.e., clouds, fit in this budget?
[Slide 12: relative greenhouse values of H2O vs. CO2. The data and quote are good, but the slide over-emphasizes Bryson's credentials. Science is never decided by experts, by voting, or by consensus forming. Honor the experts, but don't train student's to rely on them or to compare expertise. The odds are the best of us will be proved wrong one day anyway as science advances, one honored man at a time. Credentials are nice but carry no scientific weight.
[Slide 13: Beck's discovery of omitted CO2 data. Beck has made a nice contribution here. See RSJ response to Sunsettommy on 11/26/07 in "Gavin Schmidt's Response to the Acquittal of CO2 Should Sound the Death Knell for AGW". Beck shows that the IPCC selected data to fit its model. (Vostok is not spelled with a c.) Contrary to the slide, the Vostok record has profound implications to climate modeling and how the IPCC got so far off track. This should also serve as a fine example to students about cause and effect vs. correlation. The record was the smoking gun for climatologists -- at first. It proved that CO2 causes global warming, just as Keeling, Revelle, and Fourier had predicted. Then, whoops! Someone checked, and the CO2 substantially lagged temperature. Why then are the two correlated? The answer is that the CO2 is produced from the ocean, confirmed by the solubility curve shape of CO2 concentration with respect to temperature. Now we have a new datum to which the GCMs must be faithful - the outgassing of CO2, appropriately shaped like the complement of the solubility curve, and 16 times the ACO2 emissions. The GCMs need a trip back to the drawing board.
[Slide 14: Sherlock Holmes on scientific method. Actually, the scientific method has a number of steps in the development of a model, but the ordering is unimportant. Nothing is wrong with a conjecture for which one next seeks to accumulate relevant data. Philosopher Feyerabend rejected the existence of the scientific method altogether, in large part because he conceived of the method as an ordered procedure. He was wrong. A related sin of the IPCC is the selection of data that fit the model. That is another nail for the IPCC coffin.
[Slide 15: imperceptible Kyoto protocol gains. Imperceptible is quite right, but not the 0.05ºC. The Kyoto protocol effects would be unmeasurable in the background of variable natural forces. Even if one were to qualify the claim with the stock phrase, "all other things being equal", the effects predicted by current models (the only reasonable source for the 0.05ºC figure) are open loop and are an order of magnitude too great in their temperature sensitivity to greenhouse gases. All other things being constant, the Kyoto protocol presumably will cost $30 trillion for 0.005ºC maximum gain by 2050. To whom should I submit my bill for a finder's fee?
[Slide 16: random citations. What is the point of this slide? Slides 15, 16, and 17 stray off into socio-political views of counteracting AGW, and are sure to inflame atmospheric science associate professors. Your presentation was making inroads into showing that the threat was a phantom. Now you give the threat unwarranted credence by considering alternatives such as other uses for the money and the impending ice age threat.
[Slide 17: man and the environment. Hang on to the soot. Unlike the imaginary Venus-like state, Snowball Earth is a known state.
[Slide 18: energy efficiency and albedo. As I suggested in response to your post of 9/6/07, the best treatment of energy use is economic. Don't ban pollution; tax it and the market will take care of the problem. The albedo analysis is interesting, but incomplete and relatively unimportant for a couple of reasons. You show only surface albedo by surface type without the corresponding relative area of the type. Atmospheric albedo is three times as large as the total, effective surface albedo. Most important is that almost all the surface albedo is static, while the atmospheric albedo has a component proportional to surface temperature. The static part does not contribute to albedo feedback, but the temperature dependent part while quite small nonetheless has a strong negative feedback effect against global warming from any source. It is the latter that puts Earth in a conditionally stable climate state. GCMs on the other hand are unstable.
[Slide 19: Benford's solutions to an implicit global warming problem. What does "a 0.5% change" in albedo mean? Is that a percent of the 30%, or does it stand for 29.5% or 30.5%? Albedo estimates run from around 28% to maybe 36% or 37%. How much of the albedo range is measurement accuracy and how much is albedo variation? Regardless, global albedo is barely known to one significant figure. In the end, what counts in modeling is the global mean albedo, which is unmeasurable. But as your text says, a minute change can have a profound effect. These considerations don't affect Benford's planetary defense mechanisms, but they toss IPCC model results to the winds. What is your expected result from putting iron filings in the Arctic Ocean? Is the idea to interfere with the thermohaline circulation?
[Slide 20: meddling with a complicated open system. What is the meaning of the word "open"? Open as in open loop? Open as in a thermodynamic model? Is the system complicated, or is the model? Do you contend a successful model for the climate must be complicated?
[Slides 21 & 22: automobile experimental technology. This treatment is simplistic, featuring a small part of the technology as positive with respect to a phantom threat. Instead, teach the student to estimate life cycle costs, or energy usage, or cost of ownership of each candidate. Take the hydrogen fuel cell car for example. Will the hydrogen be produced from electricity generated by low efficiency, free air burning of coal? What are the fuel costs? What are the development costs of the vehicle and of fuel distribution, and how might they be recovered? What are the tax consequences? What are the manufacturing costs at various rates of production? What are the costs in disposal of the fuel cells at the end of life or after accidents? What are the costs or gains as a result of differing performance? We can do the same thing with homes considering the initial costs and life cycle costs comparing well-insulated sealed construction with minimal insulation, well ventilated styles, and here we might add in health costs. The student should learn to make trade studies and to resist the temptation of a single attractive parameter. Knowing how to build a better automobile is for a few skilled engineers. Knowing what questions to ask is a matter of science literacy for everyone. Brilliant engineers cannot compensate for stupid legislators. The converse is not true.
[Slides 24 & 25: alternatives to fossil fuels. These are more examples of technological solutions to a purely political problem, and they give credence to the phantom AGW threat. No greenhouse gas, much less benign and beneficial CO2, poses a threat. Sensible technologies to pursue are nuclear power (see next slide) and economical recovery of shale oil.
[Slide 26: alternative nuclear technologies. The implication here is that only nuclear fuels are finite. Does the illegible chart suggest that nuclear technology is at some limit of efficiency? Here's a hot link to a legible copy and the full article: http://www.nationalcenter.org/NuclearFastReactorsSA1205.pdf. Why do we care about waste heat? The chart assumes again that CO2-free energy is a positive outcome. The chart implies that storage is problematic. Here is a great place for students to practice honing a healthy skepticism.
[Slide 27: we are not claymation chickens. Isn't this the work of Nick Park and Peter Lord, and shouldn't you give attribution? Who are the "we [who] are not chickens"? Remove the politics? Through science literacy we might steer politics into some semblance of rationality. Politics was removed from the scene of energy use and environmental protection under Communism and in the emergence of the Japanese industrialization, one at the expense of economic development, and the other to the great eastward shift of economic prosperity. Meanwhile Eastern Europe and Tokyo Bay became Technicolor nightmares of pollution. Does a positive example exist anywhere for the removal of politics? Is this the familiar call for the chickens to rise up? Are the Kyoto Accords, soon to be the Bali Accords, an example of international political interference, or of chickens rising up? Or, do the chickens represent legislators? We do have "the time" so long as the Legislatures don't panic. And I agree we have strong capabilities. But, to do what? Switch to alternative fuels, or demonstrate why a switch has no climatic effect? This presentation did not set forth any well-defined problem in need of a solution, except to head off the AGW panic and its instigators, which the slides obfuscated.
Posted by Earle Stone | December 12, 2007 2:59 PM
It's with some trepidation I step way out of my league, but, here goes anyway...
I first became aware of this site earlier this summer thanks to Sunsettommy. What a revelation. Previously I've enjoyed Aubrey Mannings Earth Story, and always had a deep interest in nature and natural processes, Alfred Wegener is one of my "heroes".
Mr. Glassman PhD, you appear to me to have had the same effect on our understanding of atmospheric CO2 as Darwin did with Natural Selection.
I've attempted a "layman's simplified overview" of the Solubility Pump. I hope this is OK, and does not mislead. I'd appreciate your opinion please.
http://www.globalwarmingskeptics.info/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=94
I also have seen some suggestions about graphics.. May I suggest,
1) A graphic of monthly CO2 concentrations across the planet, latitude and longitude, as "measured" by the IPCC. It could be done for example at a 10 degrees latitude, and 20 degrees longitude grid and plotted on Excel using the surface presentation.
2) A similar scaled graphic of what the Solubility Pump predicts.
3) If it can be found, the actual raw data plotted in the same way.
Which graphic would the raw data plot (3) most closely resemble, the IPCC "measured" (1) data or the Solubility Pump (2) .....
NB - I realise there is no, or at least very little raw data available as such, but maybe someone should be persuaded to release such data for this purpose, it is in the real, empirical interest of science after all....
[RSJ: Thermohaline is a word derived from combining forms for heat and the oceanic term for salt. Since in the IPCC model, the most important factor in AGW is CO2, and since the THC is a major conveyor of CO2, the name thermohaline is rather obsolete. Your diagram and later text makes clear the salt component, but at the first mention you say it carries water and heat.
[This is a helpful if dated diagram. There might be an animated version on the 'Net. The one you chose doesn't quite fit the recent measurements by Takahashi, as shown by the IPCC in the Fourth Assessment Report, p. 523, Figure 7.8, which has the major uptake of CO2 located around the poles and the major outgassing of CO2 located in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific. Some climatologist should redraw the thermohaline circulation accordingly.
[You might want to mention a few other things about the circulation. Waters moving poleward on the surface are cooled, absorbing more and more CO2 along the way. Waters at the pole are heavily laden with CO2, helping drive the circulation down and forward. As the water descends, the water becomes under-saturated because of the pressure increase and the loss of heat to the deep waters. When the water is driven back to the surface it is warmed to tropical temperatures, so it is oversaturated and the CO2 is instantly released. This is the soda pop phenomenon with regard to both temperature and pressure.
[A major challenge to the AGW model is for the Consensus to justify its conclusion that the Mauna Loa data represent the global concentration of CO2. One thing the Consensus needs to overcome is the location of Mauna Loa in the plume of the major outgassing from the ocean. Therefore, the THC needs to be placed correctly in three dimensions to support the challenge.
[The 1/7th calculation is good, but that is due to the ocean alone. Terrestrial flux of CO2 is 20% larger than the ocean (according to the IPCC), so the total life of CO2 is already down to a mean of about 3 years. The figure of 1.5 years includes the exchange of CO2 with leaf water. These figures are all found in the IPCC reports, as is the lifetime formula.
[If we could visualize the stream of CO2 through the atmosphere, it should look like the circulation on one of the gas planets. The stream is concentrated at the sources and sinks, and diffuses in between. Spiral stripes circle the globe and move poleward.
[On the Global Warming Skeptics web site, the last sentence preceding the Carbon Dioxide Stream figure is garbled. The words up and to are run together in the third paragraph after that figure. Two paragraphs later "too merely indicate" should be "merely to indicate"
[The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide doesn't say anything about volcanoes or the volcanic nature of Hawaii. What it does say is that the plume of the Eastern Equatorial Pacific outgassing flows across Hawaii because of the Hadley cells which rise along the Equator and descend upwind of Hawaii into the trade winds. Also without more study, one cannot say that Hawaii now sits directly in that plume. The plume wanders back and forth seasonally with the winds. Hawaii may actually sit on the edge of the plume so that the well-known seasonal winds shifts directly cause a seasonal shift in the measured CO2 concentration.
[For the record, the IPCC calculates the CO2 budget in a special way. It assumes the natural CO2 is in equilibrium. It assumes that the build up at Mauna Loa, assumedly representing global CO2, is therefore all manmade. Since the build-up is only half the total, calculated anthropogenic emissions, man's emission account for half the buildup. This is poppycock -- the 50% figure. ACO2 mixes immediately into the atmospheric reservoir of CO2, slightly lowering the isotopic ratio of 14C:13C:12C. Thereafter, the processes of the solubility pump and ocean chemistry treat the whole mixture alike, with a minor exception for some plants that prefer one isotope of carbon over another. The solubility pump cannot distinguish natural CO2 from ACO2. The IPCC model implies that the solubility of the two is different.
[Your suggestion for a graph of CO2 across the planet would be delightful, but alas not realizable today. The data just don't exist. The IPCC reports a data network of just 131 stations, and I know of only about eight of them to be available on the Internet. A world of study is needed even on those data because of the investigators extensive calibration. This graph would be a version of the visualization of CO2 flow around the planet that I suggested. Perhaps this will come to pass through satellite imaging in the near future. Some climatologist should cartoon the concept.
[Similar remarks hold for the similar graphics you suggest of the Solubility Pump predictions and the raw data. This is all in the best traditions of science. Time will tell.]
Posted by Derek | December 17, 2007 1:25 AM
What I am failing to see from all this is why the modern era should be compared to an era where there wasn't a long-term, consistent CO2 pump, putting billions of tonnes of CO2 into the atmosphere annually. In the pre-industrial era, the only time I am aware of that a comparable event occurred is the Permian-Triassic boundary, 251-million years ago, and far too long ago to date temperature and CO2 changes accurately enough to repeat your analysis (massive volcanoes emitted CO2 and lava landed on massive coal fields -- a kind of natural equivalent to what we are doing today).
You are essentially hypothesising that this extra CO2 will somehow disappear, i.e., that the ocean's solubility of CO2 will increase as atmospheric CO2 increases. Or are you claiming that the physics of the greenhouse effect is incorrect?
Could you present us with the physics behind this either way, and explain why the generally accepted number, that the oceans have absorbed about a third of anthropogenic CO2, is incorrect?
If you want a variety of CO2 data, see
http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/carbontracker/
[RSJ: Your question touches on the core of science - the scientific method. The objective of climatologists is to build a model for the climate with predictive power. It is not to compare now with then. The model initialized for the past must produce the appropriate climate to some degree better than guesswork.
[If the model includes the past but fails to reproduce the past, it is invalid. The model must be repaired or discarded. If the past doesn't apply to the model, it must have objective criteria by which it excludes the past.
[Your billions of tonnes of CO2 being pumped into the atmosphere is clearly a reference to the nearly 6 GtC attributed annually to anthropogenic CO2 (ACO2), and that certainly was not in existence in the paleontological record. But it is a negligible distinction for several reasons, and it does not cause the GCMs to exclude the paleo record.
[o ACO2 is chemically and physically indistinguishable from natural CO2 (nCO2). They differ only in their isotopic ratio, 14C:13C:12C. The two mix immediately in the atmosphere to create a different mixture with an intermediate isotopic ratio. Some plants are known to discriminate (called fractionate) between 13C and 12C, but it is a trivial difference on the scale of climate. No other process distinguishes between the two species of CO2. There is no way to discriminate between old and new CO2 of either species. Differences in 14C might have some bearing, but it has no effect on the carbon cycle.
[o The nCO2 outgassed from the ocean (90 or more GtC/yr), let alone the total including emissions from the land (120 GtC/yr and leaf water (270 GtC/yr), swamp the 6 GtC/yr ACO2 contribution.
[Your reference to an event 251 million years ago would be an event measured by total atmospheric CO2 concentration on the scale of ice ages. However, that particular one is not included in the 14 events reported by the IPCC. See Figure 3.2, Third Assessment Report, p. 302. In each of these events, the concentration of atmospheric CO2 was substantially larger than the present. About nine of them were an order of magnitude greater than the Mauna Loa data. These events dwarf the catastrophe predicted by the Consensus on Climate. However, no data exists on this ice age scale to examine the relationship between CO2 and temperature, so these events can't affect the GCMs. They are not comparable to the GCM results, or to the small additions made by ACO2. An event measured by total CO2 concentration is not directly comparable to an event measured by a rate of emission any more than the total known oil reserves relates to the rate of pumping. A model is needed to make any connection.
[The analysis in The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide, like the analysis in Solar Wind, El Niño/Southern Oscillation, & Global Temperature: Events & Correlations, has no accuracy limitation beyond the inevitable limits imposed by a finite stream of noisy, sampled data. The analysis is not a climate model. It assumes nothing about the fate of the ACO2, and it hypotheses nothing beyond the implication that the physics of the past is unchanged.
[The analysis does not as you suggest assume that the solubility of CO2 in water depends on the atmospheric concentration of CO2. The analysis instead shows that the natural CO2 concentration in the Vostok record depended on global temperature according to the complement of the known solubility relationship at one atmosphere, which depends primarily on temperature alone.
[This discovery from the Vostok record must have a profound effect on global climate models. It is a major, positive feedback not in the current GCMs. If the global surface temperature increases due to added CO2, the ocean will exacerbate that increase with additional CO2. The fact that CO2 in the paleo record lags global temperature is confirmation of the analysis.
[This major positive CO2 feedback from the ocean would make the climate unstable. (Note that the word feedback here means what is described above: because of the output temperature increase in the model, CO2 is added back to the input, external driving signal of added CO2.) But the paleo record shows increases in CO2 which did not produce an instability. The inevitable conclusion is that CO2 does not cause the feared greenhouse effect, hence CO2 is acquitted.
[I do not dispute the greenhouse effect. What is disputed is a GCM which produces an unstable climate because of the greenhouse effect. Such a model throws into doubt the competence of the modeler because the climate is in a quasi-stable state. Everything known about Earth and other planets is in a quasi-stable state, albeit with a finite life or past changes due to external events.
[What the GCMs omit is the stabilizing mechanism that prevents a greenhouse catastrophe. The best bet is the albedo effect. In particular, the stabilizing effect is the tiny but critical dependence of albedo on surface temperature because of clouds. The dependence is known to climatologists, but it is not included in the current rash of GCMs. The models are not capable of reproducing clouds, much less the cloud albedo. If they could, the Consensus would learn that the greenhouse effect is reduced by the closed loop gain, by which any increase in surface temperature reduces the solar radiation reaching Earth. Cloud albedo can reduce the greenhouse effect by an order of magnitude with an albedo sensitivity to temperature too small to be measured in the state of the art.
[The physics of why the ocean has not "absorbed about a third of anthropogenic CO2" is the subject of much of the Rocket Scientist's Journal. Here you can read why Mauna Loa does not represent the global CO2 concentration. And why CO2 does not accumulate in the atmosphere. And why ACO2 does not undergo significantly different processes than nCO2. RSJ accepts the IPCC number for the rate of emission of ACO2 and for the rate of CO2 concentration increase at Mauna Loa, but disputes that the cause and effect conclusion about ocean absorption. The nCO2 cycle is not in equilibrium, being absorbed as fast as it is outgassed, while ACO2 is absorbed at a slower rate to account for the Mauna Loa increases. But this is how the climate is modeled in the GCMs. To the extent that global CO2 might be increasing, it is due to, and not the cause of, global warming.]
Posted by Philip Machanick | December 22, 2007 5:57 PM
Ah, the cloud albedo thing. This is just a theory which has not been verified by observation.
[RSJ: Apparently you've heard of it, but disparage it for some reason. If you're an AGW advocate, it must be terribly uncomfortable for you.
[You must dispute one of the following; which is it? Clouds have been observed. Clouds have been observed to reflect sunlight. These two factors establish the existence of cloud albedo. Cloud albedo is not modeled in the current rash of Global Catastrophe Models.]
Also, if you want to dispute Mauna Loa, you need to propose a better measure. On a quick scan of the sites I looked at, those well isolated from industrial areas roughly the same pattern.
[RSJ: Why must I propose a better measure, by which I presume you mean a better measure of global CO2 concentration? Why would I even want to estimate such a parameter? The AGW modelers would want to do that. The best analysis of the data available shows that carbon dioxide does not cause global warming, so why look for a better estimate of its global concentration? The best hypothesis about the climate is that the same conclusion is true for the entire greenhouse effect, and including especially water vapor.]
I haven't bothered to look at the IPCC's version of the paleoclima[]tic record because I don't want to re[-]verify whatever process they went through, hence the 251-milllion years ago case. I've since found another similar case[,] about 55-million years ago, atmospheric CO_2 levels approximately quadrupled in too short a time to measure (given the timescale) and temperatures increased 5-10C, which is in line with the models which show climactic sensitivity of about 3C per doubling of CO_2, +/- 1.5. Either these measurements are wrong or some external impulse is capable of warming the planet 5-10C in a relatively short time (in geological terms).
[RSJ: The only data worth examining is that relied on or explicitly omitted by the IPCC, as determined from its reports. The only climate crisis is that created by the IPCC and its self-proclaimed Consensus on Climate.
[You accept what the IPCC says about the paleo record, then you leave the IPCC to introduce a couple of other geological scale events of unknown pedigree, then return to the IPCC to rely on its models. In this process, you claim to have validated the two events. You make this validation by the AGW-doubling-CO2 conjecture. Even the rash Consensus on Climate doesn't claim that its GCMs are valid on the paleo (i.e., Vostok) scale, much less the geological (Ice Age) scale.
[The 251 MYA and 55 MYA measurements may indeed be wrong. Certainly the IPCC climate sensitivity of 3 ± 1.5ºC per doubling of CO2 is wrong. CO2 has an imperceptible effect on climate.
[Of course, the other mechanism for climate warming is right in front of your eyes.]
If you claim that the oceans can readily absorb large amounts of CO_2 to the extent that we needn't worry about any future large-scale emissions, you need a model to explain events like this.
[RSJ: The IPCC claims that the ocean absorbs about 92 GtC/yr. I rely on IPCC data at every juncture, and occasionally bring in additional but not conflicting data. The objective is to hang the IPCC with its own rope.
[The model for the absorption of CO2 is presented in The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide. Whether it explains the process is a subjective question, but apparently it doesn't work for you. That's why the scientific method is not about either explanation or description, but about objectivity, validation, and ultimately prediction. The model I presented invalidates the GCMs, and hence their predictions. The Consensus needs to go back to the drawing board.]
What I don't get from your solubil[]ity claim is that the CO_2 situation was in equilibrium in pre-industrial times. If we are adding CO_2 to the atmosphere and warmer water is _also_ making the seas less capable of dissolving CO_2, why should the increase in CO_2 be _solely_ due to decreased solubility?
[RSJ: The assumptions about equilibrium are made by the Consensus. I dispute those assumptions. At no time was the global temperature or the global concentration of CO2 known to be in a state of equilibrium.
[One of the problems with the GCMs is that they ignore the initial condition of the on-going warming of the climate. They initialize with an equilibrium budget. See Fig. 1.2, TAR, p. 90. Then they compound the error by assuming that natural CO2 is in equilibrium, so to model climate on the margin responding to just Anthropogenic CO2. The on-going warming thus appears to be attributed to the ACO2.
[No claim is made here that the increase in CO2 is solely due to anything. The claim is that the oceanic outgassing varies with global temperature according to the complement of the solubility curve. That it did during the Vostok record is shown quite well by the data. Assuming that the physics of the ocean hasn't changed, the outgassing today should be increasing as the climate warms.
[The temperature-dependent outgassing is likely what accounts for the record at Mauna Loa because the observatory sits in the plume of the greatest locale of outgassing, the Eastern Equatorial Pacific. The seasonal modulation of the Mauna Loa record is likely caused by the seasonal wind pattern there, moving the plume back and forth across the Islands.
[Accordingly, the GCMs need to be repaired.]
Another point -- in a comment, you mention partial pressure, which I was looking for in the main argument. If your graphs are based on a fixed partial pressure, they are wrong. Solubility will increase with increase in atmospheric CO_2. To complicate matters, the highest CO_2 solubility is in cold waters, most susceptible to global warming.
[RSJ: Not quite, and fear not. The theory of solubility is that the partial pressure of the gas in the atmosphere and of the gas in the water quickly adjust to be equal. This is called equilibration. We know neither, however.
[The IPCC doesn't handle this problem well. It defines pressure in the TAR Appendix in terms of Pascals (Pa, one Newton/meter^2) on p. 869 and in bars (bar) or millibars (mb) (p. 870), and it provides the unit conversion factors. But then it discusses the partial pressure of CO2 (pCO2) in the dimensions of concentration, parts per million (ppm). TAR, p. 200. This is common in the literature, too, and it may have led to your confusion.
[The tropical waters, and especially the Eastern Equatorial Pacific, are the most affected by global warming, and not as you say, the cold waters. This is because so long as Earth has ice caps and liquid surface oceans, the cold waters are in equilibrium with ice and so are at a constant temperature of about 0ºC.
[Whether the physics of solubility might be better modeled with partial pressures or with such refinements as salinity is irrelevant to the Acquittal of CO2. The known physics of solubility is sufficient. It represents the curvature of CO2 with temperature better than any polynomial fit. The solubility curve is the equivalent of about a fifth or sixth degree polynomial on the Vostok data set. However, the solubility curve extends beyond that domain of the ice core temperature measurements, so it has none of the physically impossible results that polynomials give beyond that domain.
[This curvature of CO2 concentration with global temperature needs to be incorporated in the AGW models, even if a better model for solubility might be possible.]
Both the 55-million year ago and 251-million year ago episodes included substantial changes in ocean chemistry (in once case, extreme acidification, the other, anoxia). Both are hypothesized to have been caused by massive volcanic eruptions which set fire to massive fields of fossil fuels -- events not too dissimilar in character to what is happening today. Unfortunately when you go back this far in the past, timescales are fuzzy, and detailed chemistry a bit of a black art. And of course there are other critical differences from today, e.g., contin[]ental configurations, so you can't read too much into comparisons. But there have been at least 2 events of this character with similar consequences ...
[RSJ: The 251 MYA event corresponds to a notable mass extinction, now popularly attributed to an asteroid. The 55 MYA event corresponds to the Palaeocene/Eocene Thermal Maximum (PETM). I have been unable to find either event or the modeling you describe in the IPCC reports. Apparently these events are part of neither the GCMs nor their data on which the IPCC and the Consensus rely, but are someone else's model. Therefore, these results are irrelevant to the promised global catastrophe, and not worth debugging. Just out of curiosity, where is this modeling published, and does it corroborate the GCMs? Are you the one who is doing the hypothesizing that you mention?
[I don't see how the volcanic activity and the fires might be similar to the modern state of the climate. ACO2 is swamped by nCO2; CO2 is swamped by water vapor; the total, the greenhouse effect, is controlled by the sensitivity of albedo to surface temperature to a negligible level. On the other hand, some severe volcanic activity appears to have snuffed out much of the life on Earth.
[A note of caution: when reviewing data, be sure that it has not been calibrated into agreement with other data or with some preconceived conjecture. The IPCC and the Consensus are guilty of this often unacceptable practice. This is especially true of the calibration of proxy data, and in the matching of CO2 records from around the globe.]
As for delta T leads delta C in ice cores, if the original impulse is a variation in the earth's orbit or solar output, you'd expect that. Since the CO_2 greenhouse effect is logarithmic in the increase in CO_2, you wouldn't expect a rapid increase in CO_2 once the external impulse was removed; assuming the sun in effect cools, all you need is for CO_2 solution in the oceans to speed up faster than new CO_2 can cause further warming. Also, if this process is happening gradually as would have been the case for the Vostok record, other CO_2 sinks come into play -- plants grow more rapidly for example, as the atmosphere warms and the CO_2 supply increases. I haven't looked at anyone's model for this but all of this seems plausible.
[RSJ: The greenhouse effect is not logarithmic. The greenhouse effect enhanced by feedbacks as modeled by the IPCC and the Consensus in their radiative forcing models exhibits a logarithmic effect. TAR, p. 93. You left out all the qualifiers. In fact, the greenhouse effect, much less the CO2 effect, is negligible. The IPCC left out the albedo dependence on surface temperature.
[Your plausible scenario is not the IPCC's, so it's not worth debugging.]
To make a case, you really need to look at the physics of solar heating and account for the fraction of delta T can reasonably be model[]ed by changes in the sun (Milankovitch cycles etc.).
[RSJ: For the IPCC treatment of the Milankovitch cycles and the CO2 lag, see TAR ¶3.3.2, p. 203. The IPCC says that indeed some event other than an increase in CO2 must have initiated the warming periods, but that the CO2 amplified it. That amplification is not evident in the data. The IPCC says that the Milankovitch cycles are "Implicated as a key factor" in global climate. Bold added. They are not a cause because some warming periods expected from the orbital variations failed to materialize in the climate record. As to changes in solar radiation, the IPCC and the Consensus have found those changes to be too small to account for observed climate changes. TAR, Summary for Policy Makers, p. 9; 4AR, ¶9.5.1.1, p. 705.
[The IPCC considered another factor arising from changes in the sun - variations in the solar wind. It dismissed this phenomenon for lack of evidence. The evidence, though, exists. See Solar Wind, El Niño/Southern Oscillation, & Global Temperature: Events & Correlations for the evidence the IPCC overlooked.
[Note that correlation here properly supports a physical model for cause and effect.]
You also need to include all the other feedbacks (reduced albedo from reduced ice, increase GHW from water vapour).
[RSJ: Why must these be included? How would they help debunk the AGW conjecture? Once the GCMs are repaired to include the already discovered omissions, such as temperature dependent albedo and temperature dependent outgassing, then they might be ripe for disclosure of other errors.]
I'm a bit suspicious of something that looks like one theory fits all in somethi[n]g as complex as the climate. Also, correlation isn't causation: just because the curves fit well, it doesn't mean they tell the whole story. The scale could be wrong (implying you have a good first order fit, but are missing amplifying feedbacks), or the effect which fits well is what has happened long-term but doesn't represent the very anom[a]ly we're trying to model. Or you could be lucky and the errors cancel out.
[RSJ: You need to replace your suspicion with skepticism. That is the scientific way.
[You knock down straw men of your own creation. You won't find a universal theory proposed here. Nor will you find here an example of correlation substituting for causation. Nor will you find a claim that curves tell the whole story.
[You misunderstand what is presented here to date. So far you have seen only analyses of errors and omissions by the IPCC and the Consensus on Climate.]
Posted by Philip Machanick | December 23, 2007 8:33 PM
A comment on the timescale of ocean mixing of dissolved CO2. A figure of 1200 years is quoted for the timescale of MECHANICAL mixing i.e. as a result of ocean currents.
However CO2 is also biologically processed. Marine organisms fix dissolved CO2. When they die, their bodies sink to the ocean floor in a timescale vastly faster than 1200 years.
If there was a mechanism to oxidise the organic carbon on the ocean floor back to CO2, this might conceivably vastly reduce the mixing timescale.
I have no figures on this, but the obvious mechanism for CO2 return is rotting.
[RSJ: The measured lag, as stated in the Acquittal of CO2, has several peaks from which a characteristic number, 1073 years, is a fair representation and produces a desirable organizing of the scattered data. It tends to support the figure of 1200 years quoted from Wikipedia, which is used in the article only in passing discussion of the Carbon Dioxide Stream of Figure 23.
[The timescale of the mixing helps build the model for the The Acquittal of CO2, but it is not critical. The shape of the CO2 concentration with temperature is now known from the paleo record, and it shows that the ocean governs the concentration of atmospheric CO2 through well-known solubility effects. That this is connected to the THC (thermohaline circulation) is hypothesized from the CO2 flux volume, the uptake and outgassing spots on the globe, the geometry of the THC, and the time lag, measured and known from other sources.
[The Conveyor Belt as a phenomenon for further study should prove a fertile field to plow. For an interesting animated discussion of the circulation, see http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/info/thc/. The animation has the circulation well-focused at the polar waters where the circulation begins its characteristic descent, but it is not well-defined where it surfaces. This circulation needs to be integrated with what is known about the flux of CO2, as shown for example in the Fourth Assessment Report, Figure 7.8. Also the weight of dissolved CO2 might prove as significant as salinity in propelling the circulation.
[In any case, the THC is a physical/mechanical transport system, but not chemical. The entire circulation structure provides a dynamic reservoir for ions and molecules, a moving lunch counter and garbage disposal for chemical reactions from surface waters to the depths around the globe. To some unknown extent, those chemical reactions should have an effect on the concentration of molecular CO2, principally for the outgassing return to the atmosphere. However, those chemical reactions should not have any first order effects on the net rate of CO2 flux between atmosphere and ocean. The IPCC notions that chemical reactions put backpressure against the dissolution of CO2 in water, and that chemical reactions are age-dependent causing the life-expectancy of CO2 in the atmosphere to be decades to centuries, challenge basic physics.
[Expecting a first order model for the climate to be affected by details of the biological processes is unreasonable. A net flux between the physical/mechanical sphere and the biological sphere will suffice as at most a second order effect.]
Posted by David Ellard | January 17, 2008 4:45 AM
Thanks for the feedback on the presentation. Some of your comments were addressed in the talk and not included on the slides. Much was not and is a valuable addition. With your permission I would like to include your comments as extra slides for the online posting as well as a basis to improve and focus content.
[RSJ: Feel free!]
The talk was designed to invite skepticism and excite dialogue. Unfortunately the Associate Professor's rhetoric foreclosed any debate, dialogue, or discussion. And I agree with your statements regarding that this rhetoric also forecloses on science and the true purpose of University.
Yup, gotta reference Nick and Peter. Without sympathetic colleagues it is difficult to get this kind of feedback and improve the talk. You have been of great help.
Clearly, as you state and I believe, what we need is to end the agenda driven panic and implement engineering solutions to economic problems. Solutions that may be neither easy nor simple, but most certainly doable and easily driven by economic forces.
[RSJ: If a problem is truly economic, trust capitalism to find an optimum solution within the boundary conditions of the infrastructure and a free (i.e., auction-driven) market place. In that context, to work through an entrepreneurial endeavor, sound engineering and economics would be university goals of choice.
[On the other hand, the notion of public ownership of the air and water, by which the government taxes our effluents, is attractive. That puts pressure back on the capitalism to fix problems. Our approach too often has been over-kill: to ban, killing whole industries or forcing them off shore to pollute at will, and shifting problems to the criminal justice system. Half a problem solved is rarely any solution at all.
[Most hypothetically speaking, if the AGW problem were valid, then a carbon tax might be just the ticket. The problem is that legislators don't have the scientific literacy to see through the fraud, and getting them to tax is like pushing a car downhill. They just gather speed. Science literacy, healthy skepticism, and a little economics need to be K-12 goals. After the twelfth grade, most legislators are beyond reach.
[Legislatures are the poorest defenders of capitalism. So in today's environment, the technician needs to be extra sure the problem is both real and well-defined.]
"There's really no need anymore to spread guilt and fear about the environment. The solution side is to try and figure out how to do things better. Not to have campaigns against everything in the world, but rather to have campaigns in which you are shifting from the way you did things before into doing things in a new way that still provides the goods and services we need but to do so at less cost to the environment."
With this in mind and your comments the presentation should find the focus and a clearer statement of the problem.
Again, Thanks very much.
[RSJ: You're welcome.]
Posted by Earle Stone | January 18, 2008 4:00 PM
The satellite data showing the trends in temperature change from stratosphere to lower troposphere indicates that the only temperature we need to worry about is the surface temperature. Vincent Grey has already discussed that the methodology used is inadequate to declare a "crisis". A recent peer reviewed article by Patrick Michaels and Ross McKitrick looks into the data quality of the surface temperature readings and indicates that the increase is overestimated and may be overestimated by as much as 50%. A lay version of the paper is available at
http://www.uoguelph.ca/~rmckitri/research/jgr07/M&M.JGR07-background.pdf
The full paper published in The Journal of Geophysical Research
http://www.uoguelph.ca/~rmckitri/research/jgr07/M&M.JGRDec07.pdf
In the end it is not the CO2. I fear no number of facts will change the minds of believers.
[RSJ: McKitrick and Michaels 2007 is the next response in a dialog with the IPCC, which responded negatively to McKitrick and Michaels 2004 on the same subject. 4AR, ¶3.2.2.2, p. 244. McKitrick and Michaels 2007 correct an allegedly minor error in their 2004 paper, but conclude "the IPCC gridded data is [sic] contaminated by extraneous socioeconomic signals, a finding that is confirmed and strengthened in the present paper." P. 3. This gridded data set Climatologists use to initialize certain GCMs (4AR, ¶8.2.7, p. 607), and it comprises, at least at times, daily temperature data (4AR, ¶9.4.3.2, p. 698). Strictly speaking, that would not be interpreted to be daily temperature trend data, which McKitrick and Michaels analyze. Writers sometimes refer to temperature trend data simply as warming.
[Upon a couple of reads through the full paper, the math has all the earmarks of a sound and thorough approach, with a couple of exceptions. A full expert opinion would require copies of the data sets and a couple of months to reproduce the analysis. In any case, here are some problems with the 2007 paper.
[McKitrick and Michaels should have provided a link to temperature trend data in the IPCC reports, one which would show the importance the IPCC attaches to those data. The IPCC discussion seems rather thorough, mostly concentrated in 4AR, ¶3.2.2, pp. 241-245, but in the end troubled and inconclusive. The IPCC does report somewhat ambiguously that socioeconomic factors are statistically insignificant in the warming record. Clearly, the IPCC wants the best record of surface temperature possible just on scientific principles. What is not clear is the IPCC concern and need for accuracy for initializing its GCMs, as opposed to its concern for a warning system for impending global catastrophe.
[McKitrick and Michaels model the following equation:
Suppose there are i = 1, . . ., n locations around the world at which temperature is measured. In each location i a climatic trend Ti over the interval t = [1979:1-2002:12] in C/decade is sought, but what is actually measured is an observed trend &thetai:
&thetai = Ti + f(Si) + g(Ii),
where f and g are functions of unknown form, Si represents surface processes and Ii represents inhomogeneities.
[First, temperature and temperature differences are directly measurable as with thermometers and infrared sensors. I am unaware of any transducer that responds to temperature trends, so trends would not be "actually measured." Therein lies a problem.
[Temperature trend data are calculated from temperature data. This is called filtering or, in part, smoothing. Done properly, which is not terribly difficult, it can have the effect of reducing the variance (variability or noise) inherent in raw data. But if the trend calculations use overlapping raw data, for example, as in running averages, the filtering introduces color into the noise. Also where data samples are subject to common errors, as in calibration or registration errors, the measurement errors become colored. With colored noise, trends in the noise compete with trends in the underlying, or systemic, process to be analyzed. Where the sampling interval is itself noisy, as with synchronization or missing data problems, calculated trends have another component of error not present in the raw data. Engineers might recognize this problem in filtering as the "differentiation of noise", which good signal processing techniques assiduously avoid. A trend is a time or spatial rate involving the ratio of two random variables, and the analyst needs to be careful that the denominator is nearly noise free, as with perfect clocking of samples. The ratio of two random variables can behave quite badly, and can even be unstable.
[A second problem with filtering and smoothing is that samples of filtered random variables are likely to be correlated even when the raw random variables were not. The smoothed, nonzero population growth rate of nematodes is correlated with the smoothed, nonzero temperature trend.
[Good data reduction practices are not to rely on statistical analysis of filtered data. Instead, one should apply the statistical methods to the raw data, developing a model for the underlying system process, then extract the rate from the process model. I would like to see McKitrick and Michaels repeat their analysis on the raw temperature data, then apply their techniques to the removal of geographic, socioeconomic and other factors.
[In favor of McKitrick and Michaels work is the strength of their results. That is, their results should hold even if they had worked from raw data. On the other hand, the correlations, fits and rejections would have been even stronger had they used raw data. Additional information might be extracted from the data using the preferred method. The set of significant parameters might be brought even more into focus.
[Similar observations apply to the set of parameters McKitrick and Michaels chose for their surface processes and inhomogeneities. They used derived parameters calculated as rates, as in parameters expressed per capita and per unit area. The validation of their technique lies in their success, but I would have preferred a study including the numerators and denominators comprising the rates as independent variables.
[At the end of their analysis, McKitrick and Michaels compare "distributions of temperature trends" for (a) IPCC surface data, (b) satellite (Microwave Sounding Unit) tropospheric data, and (c) IPCC data filtered again by their results to remove residual socioeconomic effects. Figure 3, p. 11. They say, "The effect of removing the local distortions as estimated by the model is to bring the shape of the surface data distribution more closely into line with that of the satellite-measured lower troposphere data".
[First, a quibble to get the vocabulary right: the curves of Figure 3 are densities, not distributions. A distribution always runs from 0 to 1 (100%), increasing monotonically (i.e., maybe flat for awhile, but never decreasing). More importantly, as the number of samples increases (for real, physical variables) the distribution curve will converge to the underlying process distribution. That is not true for the densities!
[Also, the shape of the density histograms can be quite sensitive to the selection of the histogram interval. A little change in registration or a different selection of the width can have a sudden and unexpected effect on the shape of the envelope. This is not true for distribution histograms. But even at that, histograms are unnecessary, and an ill-advised source of data reduction error. What should be calculated is the cumulative number of samples less than or equal to every point on the abscissa, requiring just n calculations for n points.
[McKitrick and Michaels appear to have fit curves to the densities. They should recalculate using the cumulative number of samples for each parameter, fit a cumulative distribution curve to the cumulative plot, then differentiate the cumulative distribution curve to portray a density curve. Some of the wiggles in their density curves should disappear as data reduction artifacts. Comparing the distribution curves for the three parameters can remove other artifacts, such as insignificant tales. The curves should be compared for the bulk of the data, usually clustered around the means.
[McKitrick and Michaels say,
While we do not assert that the ''true'' average land-based climatic warming trend is 0.17 C/decade, our analysis does suggest that nonclimatic effects are present in the gridded temperature data used by the IPCC and that they likely add up to a net warming bias at the global level that may explain as much as half the observed land-based warming trend. P. 11
[I was unable to verify that the IPCC used gridded temperature trend data to initialize their models, as McKitrick and Michaels imply. A more reasonable initialization for the GCMs should be the local temperature, not the temperature trend.
[However, I do agree that wherever the IPCC has neglected a warming influence, that has contributed improperly to its model and to its conclusions about anthropogenic influences. The best example with the most profound effect is the IPCC's neglect of the cloud albedo.
[I agree with you that CO2 is not guilty. And changing the minds of believers is somewhat a pointless task. We must work on the subset of believers who forgot that science is not about belief, but about predictive power. We must work on the subset of climatologists who forgot that scientific models must fit all the data in their domain before making predictions. The IPCC is a ponderous, barnacle-covered supertanker with a cargo and crew of believers and non-skeptical scientists. Science is the tugboat that will eventually turn it.]
Posted by Earle Stone | January 23, 2008 11:20 AM
Accusing me of straw targets ... why do you keep comparing my arguments to the IPCC? I am not the IPCC. A couple of points ...
[RSJ: I compare your arguments to the IPCC reports for the reason I gave you in response to your post of 12/23/07: "The only data worth examining is that relied on or explicitly omitted by the IPCC, as determined from its reports. The only climate crisis is that created by the IPCC and its self-proclaimed Consensus on Climate."]
You say you are not using pure correlation. I don't see anything else in your analysis. If atmospheric CO2 is increased from a source such as industrial combustion, the equilibrium point of CO2 in the air vs. the sea ought to shift to a new higher concentration in the sea, and a new higher concentration in the air. Why is there a problem with this?
[RSJ: Our exchange so far hasn't used the phrase "pure correlation".
[Here's a restatement of some relevant points from my modeling that you have failed to discover. The solar wind affects Earth's mean cloud cover. The surface temperature also affects cloud cover variability, causing a dominant negative feedback that controls Earth's surface temperature. The concentration of CO2 is dominantly controlled by the ocean temperature.
[Your model of ACO2 increasing the air and sea concentration of CO2 is fine. It's just trivial. Consider the amount of ACO2 added to the amount of nCO2 added, and the share of CO2 as a GHG compared to water vapor. Then consider the possible effects of any GHG increase in light of the negative feedback of cloud albedo. Finally consider how little the GHG can affect climate compared to a little change in average cloud albedo. The AGW conjecture is way down in the noise.]
You say "The 251 MYA event corresponds to a notable mass extinction, now popularly attributed to an asteroid." The evidence for an asteroid is weak, e.g. see
Koeberl K, Farley KA, Peucker-Ehrenbrink B, Sephton MA (2004). Geochemistry of the end-Permian extinction event in Austria and Italy: No evidence for an extraterrestrial component. Geology 32 (12): 1053-1056.
Here's a good reference to compare the Permian-Triassic event with one where there was strong evidence for an impact event:
Tanner LH, Lucas SG & Chapman MG (2004). Assessing the record and causes of Late Triassic extinctions. Earth-Science Reviews 65 (1-2): 103-139.
You'll see the scenarios are very different -- the PT event resulted in a larger increase in atmospheric CO2 off a lower base, with catastrophic environmental consequences (see particularly p 124).
[RSJ: Your reference contradicts your summary:
[Nevertheless, carbon exchange between the oceans and atmosphere and carbon drawdown by weathering on land limits the buildup of volcanigenic carbon in the atmosphere [citation]. … Moreover, abundant data exist that suggest that the Late Triassic atmosphere had a greatly elevated (over 2000 ppm) CO2 content prior to the CAMP [Central Atlantic Magmatic Province] eruptions [citation], which decreases the sensitivity of climate to changes in atmospheric CO2 [citation]. Considered thus, the impact on the atmosphere of CO2 from CAMP emissions was probably much less than that required for a significant disturbance of global climate and the biosphere. Tanner, et al, p. 124.
[The base of CO2 appears to have been about 2000 ppm, unless you have some other meaning for "off a lower base" it was much higher than today's 370 ppm or so. Tanner et al also say,
[This invalidates the hypothesis of Beerling et al. (2002) of massive CO2 release as the driving mechanism of the K-T extinction. Tanner, et al., p. 121
[Your link of PT event -> atmospheric CO2 -> catastrophe, presumably the mass extinction, is contrary to your authority.]
I am not trying to nitpick or defend the IPCC. I am exploring the outliers, to see if the science is substantially correct. That means looking at evidence that the science may be predicting less catastrophic change than may happen as well as the opposite. The P-T event is one case that suggests the IPCC is erring on the side of optimism.
If you really want to engage with the science, you have to look for error where you least want to find it not only where you would be happy to find it. I would not be happy to find that AGW is a much worse problem than the IPCC predicts, but it would be stupid not to investigate this possibility.
[RSJ: You're trying "to see if the science is substantially correct"? By that you must mean the IPCC science! The answer to that is in. The IPCC is wrong on its modeling and its ultimate conclusions. According to Tanner, et al., CO2 at five times the present concentration could not have caused the PT event. Also five times as much CO2 did not produced the IPCC's feared "tipping point" leading to irreversible changes or catastrophe.
[Science postulates models with which to make predictions. The models first must fit all the data in their domain, or they are invalid. The GCMs are invalid. What the GCMs do predict is unprecedented and unreasonable in light of what is known about the past and about physics. Science needs to put a moratorium on this hunt for errors pending the next generation of GCMs. Meanwhile, government spending and voting to reduce carbon emissions should be seen as contraindicated, another pseudoscientific folly. Carbon dioxide is benign and beneficial. It is a greening agent, and probably the optimum effluent.]
Posted by Philip Machanick | January 30, 2008 10:46 PM
Dr Glassman, your writings are fantastic.
[RSJ:Fantastic?
[1. conceived or appearing as if conceived by an unrestrained imagination; odd and remarkable; bizarre; grotesque: fantastic rock formations; fantastic designs.
[2. fanciful or capricious, as persons or their ideas or actions: We never know what that fantastic creature will say next.
[3. imaginary or groundless in not being based on reality; foolish or irrational: fantastic fears.
[4. extravagantly fanciful; marvelous.
[5. incredibly great or extreme; exorbitant: to spend fantastic sums of money.
[6. highly unrealistic or impractical; outlandish: a fantastic scheme to make a million dollars betting on horse races.
[7. Informal. extraordinarily good: a fantastic musical.
[Dictionary.com Unabridged, (v 1.1)]
I must confess I do not understand them all, but as a businessman I can 'read between the lines' and pick up the overall themes and conclusions which appear to be far ahead of anything the IPCC are capable of!
[RSJ: The IPCC is quite capable of understanding the papers posted here, and should have had the work done itself. Its Reports and the authorities it cites are rich in excellent science, written by many capable scientists. Its conclusions, though, are unwarranted, and they have distorted many of its authorities. Its promotion of what is no more than an incomplete conjecture for public policy is unethical.
It does grate though that you refer to the IPCC as 'the Consensus'. The IPCC total at most 2,500 scientists (how many are just researchers has not been established). But even that number is insignificant compared to the 19,000 scientists that have signed against AGW organised by Frederick Seitz. Link. http://www.oism.org/pproject/
[RSJ:A repeated theme on this blog is that there would be no climate crisis but for the IPCC, at least no rational crisis, nor any crisis which man could reasonably avert. The IPCC and its supporters promote anthropogenic global warming by models with gaping holes, and rely instead on an alleged consensus to promote political action.
[In an address to a Climate Action Summit in 2006, Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger said,
[the debate is over, and the science is in, and it's now time for action.
[The IPCC declares without limitation,
[Scientists have determined that human activities … are responsible for most of the warming observed over the past 50 years.
[The IPCC comes right up to the edge of saying AGW is supported by a consensus. When it gets close, it resorts to a form of passive voice, saying its models are in agreement, or that a consensus exists within its models. On many fine points, the Reports clarify that no consensus exists, implying that on the larger scale consensus has been reached. IPCC supporters are not so cautious. See: Just what is this Consensus anyway?, which says "the IPCC report contains the consensus". It continues with four "main points", of which the first three are unqualified:
[The main points that most would agree on as "the consensus" are:
[1. The earth is getting warmer (0.6 +/- 0.2 ºC in the past century; 0.1 0.17 ºC/decade over the last 30 years (see update)) [ch 2]
[2. People are causing this [ch 12] (see update)
[3. If GHG emissions continue, the warming will continue and indeed accelerate [ch 9]
[http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=86. See also, The Wall Street Journal vs. The Scientific Consensus. http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2005/06/the-wall-street-journal-vs-the-consensus-of-the-scientific-community/. Statistical analysis of consensus, which "proves" the existence of the consensus by showing that 100% of peer reviewed papers in N Oreskes' sample "support the consensus view that a significant fraction of recent climate change is due to human activities." http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=80. Of course, what the survey supports is that peer-reviewed journals simply do not publish non-conformist papers.
[On 6/7/05, eleven prestigious science academies, including the National Academy of Sciences for the United States, signed an agreement calling for "prompt action to reduce the causes of climate change". Its note section begins,
1 This statement concentrates on climate change associated with global warming. We use the UNFCCC definition of climate change, which is 'a change of climate which is attributed directly or indirectly to human activity that alters the composition of the global atmosphere and which is in addition to natural climate variability observed over comparable time periods'.
2 IPCC (2001). Third Assessment Report. We recognise the international scientific consensus of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). Bold added.
[The RSJ reference to the IPCC report as the Consensus on Climate is well-supported. It should grate on everyone, scientist and politician alike, and every businessman, that a scientific body would rely on a consensus, real or alleged, to validate a conjecture, and to promote political action based on such a model. Its own authorities recognize that science does not advance by consensus-forming, but nonetheless the IPCC does so to teach politicians that there is no dispute, and "the science is in".
[As fallacious as science by consensus is, a counterargument based on a contrary consensus is equally fallacious. That applies to Seitz's list of 19,000 and Senator Inhoff's list of 400. Consensus forming is no part of the scientific method, and it should not be given credence by assembling a counter consensus. Also, that argument is off-target, disputing what the IPCC does not expressly state.
[Consensus formation is inevitable. It's human, and it happens all the time - until some individual comes up with a better model, or disproves the existing model. The old model is then discarded, or modified to accommodate the new. That is part of the scientific method.
[What is missing in the Schwarzenneggers, Gores, Hillarys, Obamas, and McCains is not scientific skill, but minimal scientific literacy. It's the kind of stuff that should be taught in K-12 to give citizens some protection against charlatans and quackery.
[The rest of your comment is omitted because it amounts to about 600 words copied almost verbatim from Tom Harris and John McLean, The UN Climate Change Numbers Hoax, 12/14/07, which is your citation to http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/968. The authors touch on Mann's Hockey Stick reduction, adopted by the IPCC in its Third Assessment Report, and criticized by McIntyre and McKitrick. Based on that reduction, the IPCC downgraded the Medieval Warm Period and the Little Ice Age to, at most, regional phenomena. See TAR, ¶2.3.3, pp. 133-136. McIntyre and McKitrick seem to have had some effect. In the Fourth Assessment Report, the IPCC restores some credibility to these epochs, adding dates and a definition for the Little Ice Age, and here and there dispensing with quotation marks around the terms. Regardless, the acceptance of an erroneous Mann reduction is not a fatal flaw to the primary results of the IPCC model.
[Harris and McLean contains neither an alternative climate model nor a significant contradiction to the IPCC model. Their article deals mostly with the numbers game of consensus counting. It is a non-scientific distraction from this blog's developing objective: exposing the IPCC AGW model as invalid, based on its own data and omissions.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | March 22, 2008 7:39 PM
OK, so if this site is devoted to analysing the IPCC AGW models how are they doing?
Has Dr. Glassman's CO2 pump been fully included in the IPCC models yet?
[RSJ: The answer won't be known or knowable until the Fifth Assessment Report, likely another five years in the future. In the meantime, modelers will be free to experiment, publish in closed journals, repair their models into some semblance of consistency, and announce the new Consensus in the 5AR.
[Even then, don't expect the GCMs, built around vertical cells and radiative forcing, to be able in any straightforward manner to model the three-dimensional behavior of the THC or the global average cloud cover which is dependent on the hydrological cycle. Efficiency demands that climatologists come to appreciate the effects of cloud albedo first, for then they would lose any ardor for faithful modeling of the carbon cycle and the feedback-controlled greenhouse effect.]
I note 2 conflicting articles. 1 study (Dec'07) saying "comparing the composite output of 22 leading global climate models with actual climate data finds that the models do an unsatisfactory job of mimicking climate change in key portions of the atmosphere."
Link. http://tinyurl.com/3bjtpm
Another saying "A new study by meteorologists at the University of Utah shows that current climate models are quite accurate and can be valuable tools for those seeking solutions on reversing global warming trends."
Link. http://tinyurl.com/5kqv95
The 2nd article claims "Most of these models project a global warming trend that amounts to about 7 degrees Fahrenheit over the next 100 years." Is this more highly selective reporting of the results, namely the highest 1 or 2 outcomes whilst not reporting the lowest 22 runs which predicted zero or no warming!
Finally just to take issue with one of your replies to my above post. There's no way the layman can understand good science as we're not scientists! We can't understand the elements and reactions or have the maths skills to validate risks or statistically analyse the validity of results.
[RSJ: Laymen aren't asked to be scientists. In this case, however, laymen are asked to make sacrifices on the scale of their economies, their health care systems, their national defense, and any other program competing for a major part of a nation's budget, in response to an unvalidated scientific model. You should have or should develop, or insist your government representative have or develop, a minimal scientific literacy, one sufficient to put that model on public trial. You should learn the differences between the grades of scientific models -- conjectures, hypotheses, theories, and laws - and the ethical imperative for scientists to urge public action on nothing less than an established theory. You should come to appreciate why the Anthropogenic Global Warming model is at most a mere conjecture. And why it is a scientific fraud growing to unprecedented proportions.
[But you have lots of time. No one is coming across the border to kill all the laymen. It's only capital -- your money and your industries -- perfectly expendable as waste.]
Secondly while I fully understand 'consensus' is not valid ground for a science law it is a valid basis for countering the politicians claims there is a scientific consensus. The Oregon/Frederick Seitz Petition puts together 19,000 science accredited individuals who in their knowledge (better than the layman's view) think AGW has no basis and the political 'solutions' also have no validity. That is very valuable, not as a science in itself, but as a social and political tool to counter the AGW's strongest arguments.
[RSJ: Good point. But as entertaining as the game may be, it's not match play decided by how many fans sit on each side of the field. Nor is it to be decided by a clutch of clever sportswriters. It's the strength and skill of the players in the contest.
[To the extent you make decisions by voting, you're on a random walk to doom and ruination. The same is true of decision-making by expert opinion. What is needed is objectivity, and that requires facts, not opinions, and the light of day.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | April 14, 2008 3:56 PM
RSJ,
Many thanks once again for your answers. Really appreciated :)
I fully understand 'consensus' whether argued by the AGW crew or the 'Naturals' is 'a game' but this is a game - it's politics - and that's where the battleground is to be won or lost. This game on who 'owns' the territory is essential politically although it has no scientific merit undoubtedly.
But unfortunately scientific merit itself does not even decide much among you scientists from what I can see!
There are still scientists devoted to the AGW argument that think there's scientific evidence to support AGW, which they obviously believe is more than a 'theory'. Further there are 'Naturals' like Roger Penske Sr. that believe man does have a localised weather impact (clearing forest for agriculture effects localised weather) and may have some/a small impact (i.e., as little as 1% on hurricanes) at global levels even if ultimately he doesn't believe man is having any great impact whatsoever.
I've seen the 'scientific' argument at every level. From me arguing with fellow citizens on forums, scientists arguing with scientists and politicians arguing with politicians. And at each level each side seems to have some facts to back their case even if like you, I believe their facts are based on claiming a lame duck can fly!
That's 'the game' at the moment. The science on the Naturals side may be considerably stronger but there's enough uncertainty in the scientific debate for the AGW crew to hang on by their fingernails even if the likes of Al Gore now needs 3 Range Rovers for security, avoids any public debate on the issues and bans the Press from his $3,000 a minute green speeches to avoid answering any questions.
Pathetic a scientific debate is reduced to this, and I'm sorry to bring the politics onto this page but that's where it's at!
Until we get another 2 years of global cooling and someone establishes once and for all CO2 is having no effect on atmospheric temperature.
Your concerns about the economic impacts of Government actions I could write chapter and verse on. From Ethanol fuels to CO2 taxes to alternative energy. Those debates are political too though I have to say are far easier to expose the flaws in.
[RSJ: Let's characterize the problem. A group of scientists claim, based on modeling, that a calamity affecting all humanity is looming, and urge world governments, and especially the US, take immediate and extremely expensive action. Science would thus drive politics. The two fields, politics and science, are inextricably linked. What is the appropriate response for politicians?
[On the 4/18/08 morning show, Fox News Channel carried an interview by Brian Kilmeade of California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, including the State's actions to reduce greenhouse gases. Brian asked the Governor's thoughts about the lack of consensus on climate warming, and what he knew that the critics did not. His answer: "I think that they know the reality, I think they are just trying to protect business." He might have meant "trying to protect American industrial might", but that hopeful interpretation is unlikely in light of the popular blacklisting of AGW skeptics. E.g., Greenpeace's exxonsecrets.org; realclimate.org.
[The proponents of AGW have scored political points by (1) proclaiming a false consensus, and (2) libeling all opposition by association or by ad hominems. Politicians in the majority need a sensitivity to both these practices. One prerequisite is a modicum of science literacy, which seems surprisingly lacking even among highly honored scientists.
[The AGW model is invalid, and it fails minimum scientific standards for use as a basis for public policy. Principles of science transcend any particular field of science, and must be satisfied. A model must fit all the data in its domain just to be a sensible conjecture. To be a hypothesis, I say it must advance at least one non-trivial prediction. A model has predictive power when a significant prediction is validated by experiment, and then it is a theory. And only then is it ethically suitable for public action.
[GCMs are scientific models, but they neither fit all the data nor contain a testable proposition, except the catastrophe a century from now. Short term discrepancies are weather, or are chalked up to climate variability. The models cannot be qualified for use to prevent the disaster. Politicians need enough science literacy to demand the AGW proponents validate their GCMs before any government acts on them.
[Beyond the missing prerequisites of science, the IPCC reports fail for abuses of data, inconsistencies, omissions, misperceptions, and exaggerations. Here's a sampler:
[Abuse of data: (a) The IPCC calibrates CO2 concentration records from different sites to make them globally similar. (b) The IPCC compares records reduced to anomalies by subtracting a baseline value for each record, and then discarding the site-dependent baseline values.
[Inconsistency: The IPCC claims that CO2 is an LLGHG, a long-lived greenhouse gas, persisting in the atmosphere variously for decades, centuries, and even millennia, however the residence time by the IPCC formula and data is between 1.5 and perhaps 5 years.
[Omissions: (a) The effects of the solar wind, and the creation of cloud cover, and hence total cloud albedo, from atmospheric water vapor are not simulated. (b) The IPCC treats natural CO2 and water vapor flux as being in equilibrium (and forcings) instead of temperature dependent (and feedbacks). (c) The IPCC does not compute closed loop feedback gains. (d) The IPCC ignores that Mauna Loa sits in the plume of the ocean CO2 outgassing, and that Vostok sits in the Antarctic CO2 sink. (e) GCMs do not simulate the thermohaline circulation (THC). (f) The IPCC computes an open loop greenhouse effect instead of the actual closed loop greenhouse effect.
[Misperceptions: (a) The IPCC considers feedback to be the correlation between signals. (b) The IPCC treats biological processes in the ocean as a bottleneck to CO2 solubility within relatively stagnant vertical columns, when CO2 is absorbed dynamically across the surface of the ocean. (c) Without recognition, much less justification, the IPCC treats the solubility of natural and anthropogenic CO2 in water as different.
[Exaggerations: (a) The IPCC claims the industrial era CO2 concentrations are unprecedented in the last half million years, a claim with a 3% confidence limit. (b) The IPCC necessarily claims that atmospheric CO2 is well-mixed, yet admits to the contrary that latitudinal CO2 gradients are an order of magnitude greater than longitudinal CO2 gradients. (c) GCMs substitute key physical process simulations with parameterizations that apparently are no more than static, stationary, statistical estimates.
[In addition, the IPCC reports rely on thousands of citations to papers only available for a fee, and generally without sufficient quotations. The Freedom of Information Act should be imposed.
[Reputable scientists would have discovered these problems for themselves, and never have left them unresolved before going public. None of these questions is inherently incomprehensible to politicians. They need to know enough to demand the IPCC respond to each, and disallowing the IPCC the political defenses of consensus or expert qualifications.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | April 16, 2008 4:43 PM
Dr. Glassman;
I have stumbled across a thought that may or may not have merit. I understand many basic sciences, but I don't have the resources to put any theoretical numbers behind my thought. It has to do with the absorption of infrared radiation by not just CO2 as we think of it, but by isotope mix. There are 18 common configurations of CO2. Each of them absorbs a varying spectra of IR. My initial epiphany came from a debate I had with someone about cosmic rays not causing increased heating. Then I remembered the conversion of nitrogen 14 to carbon 14 in the atmosphere. Carbon 14 is the only radioactive atom of the six isotopes of carbon and oxygen. I wondered what balance the atmosphere would achieve in the CO2, if the increase in carbon 14 in CO2 would have any noticeable effect.
Anyone have the proper background and resources to provide a valid theory on this?
My fear of this beyond a minor change in atmospheric chemistry is that fossil fuels are so old, the carbon 14 is almost nonexistent in coal, oil, and natural gas. However, we have a push for biofuels which will in my opinion, increase the carbon 14 levels of CO2 in the atmosphere. Since it isn't a linear effect, I fear increasing the output of CO2 with carbon 14 may actually have a noticeable change in the greenhouse effect.
[RSJ: You're correct about 14C being absent in fossil fuel emissions. Also those emissions are low in 13C, and hence in δ13C, the ratio 13C/12C. The IPCC recognizes these facts as signatures of fossil fuel emissions. TAR, ¶3.1, p. 188. Nevertheless, the IPCC uses only δ13C to estimate the content of ACO2 in the record of CO2 concentration. For a discussion of δ13C see Stable carbon isotopes in atmospheric CO2, TAR, Box 3.6, p. 207. In the Fourth Assessment Report, the IPCC shows Global emissions in GtC/yr between 1970 and 2005 and δ13C from Mauna Loa for the years 1981 to 2005 on a single, dual ordinate graph. 4AR, ¶2.3.1, Atmospheric Carbon Dioxide, Figure 2.3, p. 138. (These two references introduce the IPCC reliance on the isotopes of carbon. At the same time, they are also examples of abysmal scientific practices by the IPCC, but beyond the scope of and distracting from your questions.)
[The source of the Mauna Loa data is Keeling, C.D., A.F. Bollenbacher, and T.P. Whorf, 2005: Monthly atmospheric 13C/12C isotopic ratios for 10 SIO stations. In: Trends: A Compendium of Data on Global Change. Carbon Dioxide Information Analysis Center, Oak Ridge National Laboratory, U.S. Department of Energy, Oak Ridge, TN, http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/iso-sio/iso-sio.html, dated March, 2005. A contemporaneous paper prepared by S. C. Piper for the Scripps Institution on the same subject, and involving the same participants, discusses the 14C signature. See A Study of the Abundance and 13C/12C Ratio of Atmospheric Carbon Dioxide to Advance the Scientific Understanding of Terrestrial Processes Regulating the GCC, October, 2005, http://www.osti.gov/bridge/product.biblio.jsp?osti_id=861630. It discusses development of the ratio δ14C (14C/12C), claiming "unprecedented precision of 1 to 2‰" on 5-liter samples, but without a comparison, calling it an "underutilized tracer" and suggesting it might be used for three other applications, including "constraining rates of fossil-fuel burning".
[So your question about whether the increase in 14C due to a shift to non-fossil fuels would be noticeable, the answer is almost. The state of the art appears to be that 14C measurement is just now becoming accurate enough to be useful, given the sample size. The small and gradual increase in 14C due to the shift should require further improvements, or much larger samples.
[Relative to your other question, whether the shift to non-fossil fuels would make a difference in the greenhouse effect, the answer is no. The shift would cause ACO2 to become more like natural CO2, where the prevalence of 14CO2 is about one molecule in a trillion. http://hypertextbook.com/physics/modern/half-life/. So if 100% of ACO2 had the signature of natural CO2, 14C would have no measurable greenhouse effect just due to its abundance.
[Natural CO2 would need 14C to be 10 billion times as prevalent, 1% of CO2, for it to be significant as a greenhouse gas, assuming it had a significantly different absorption spectrum. But in lieu of actual data, the odds are that the spectrum of 14C compared to, say, 12C, would be minute, comprising slight line shifts or small lines on the skirts. The absorption spectrum of CO2 in general is quite different than that of H2O, but the effect is arguably second order in the total calculus of the greenhouse effect.
[Also, CO2 is only one fourth of the greenhouse effect. It is far less important than H2O as a greenhouse gas, in the ratio of about 60% for water to 26% for CO2. The ACO2 is quite small compared to natural CO2, about 6 GtC/yr compared to 90 GtC/yr from the ocean plus 120 GtC/yr from the land, which is only 3% (per year), not including leaf water exchanges.
[Lastly, the IPCC greatly exaggerates the greenhouse effect. It computes an open loop effect, ignoring the reduction by the closed loop gain through cloud albedo feedback. The error I predict could easily be an order of magnitude.
[Bottom line: you needn't worry about the greenhouse effect, much less CO2, much, much less 14CO2 from non-fossil fuels.]
Posted by Charles Standley | April 16, 2008 6:21 PM
Back to science. The Vostok data shows CO2 outgassing lags temperature rise by 400 to 1,400 years. And the Carbon Cycle, or time CO2 takes from being taken up in colder oceans, to being outgassed, is approx 1,000 yrs.
Therefore has the current high CO2 levels come from the recent mini ice age of 800 yrs ago?
I've also seen another mention of CO2 levels (outgassing) from oceans on a much shorter cycle of 9 months to temperature change, is this sea surface outgassing?
[RSJ: Ocean currents are rather ragged, comprising eddies or gyres, probably in three dimensions, and possibly random jumps or turbulence in the THC between quasi-stable states, like a tightly twisted cable. The current patterns are long term averages, subject to daily variations, and especially poorly characterized below the surface. Such natural randomness, to say nothing of the major measurement errors, will color the delays, turning any sharp lines into multiple, broad correlation peaks. So one shouldn't put too much emphasis on a specific number for the millennium delay.
[The Vostok data show two or three CO2 lagging peaks around 1000 years, and any one of them is a far better selection than any smaller lag, including any CO2 lead term. However, the states of ocean and atmospheric currents at the time are not known.
[The Acquittal of Carbon Dioxide is an analysis of the Vostok record, and that is not suited to resolving a 9 month cycle. If a nine month signal appears in the modern atmospheric CO2 and temperature cross-correlation, you might look for a previously unrecognized, deep current to account for it.
[In the outgassing concept developed from The Acquittal, ocean currents collect CO2 all across the ocean surface, effectively instantaneously in equilibrium given by the solubility curve. When the currents descend at the poles, they are in equilibrium with ice, so they are saturated with CO2 at 0 ºC and one atmosphere pressure, regardless of the global average surface temperature at the time. As the currents descend, they become undersaturated because of increasing pressure, and stay so until rising to the surface. The outgassing would then equilibrate according to the solubility curve at one atmosphere and for the hottest ocean temperature at the time of the outgassing. In this model, the outgassing concentration depends on the climate at the time, and not at all on the age of the water.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | April 16, 2008 9:28 PM
I believe it would also be useful to have a discussion of how the evaporation, condensation, rain cycle serves to move heat from the surface of the earth to the upper atmosphere where the heat is dissipated by black body radiation. The cold rain scrubs CO2 from the atmosphere and carries it into the oceans and lands where it becomes utilized in a related cycle. How much cooling does a hurricane provide? The pounds of water that are cooled (BTUs of energy) by a hurricane is astounding.
CO2 is utilized by plant life to create cellulose predominantly in the ocean. When these plants die and decay in an anaerobic environment they fall to the bottom and become covered by sand and inorganic sediment. Over years they are compressed and eventually become oil and natural gas deposits. A great deal of the CO2 also becomes bound into minerals in the ocean and on the lands.
There are a tremendous number of interconnected cycles that feedback, and cause the cyclical characteristics of climate. The energy from the sun and cyclical variation in the sun's energy generation, and various influences that cause the absorption of energy from the sun, is likely the underlying and overriding driver for climate cycles and variations. Man has little to do with this cycle.
The public needs to know of these complexities, so they are not sold a bill of goods by politicians.
[RSJ: You are correct that these are important considerations for heat and material flow over the globe, but at what level? Scientific principles and models are strongly scale dependent. Generally a science can be divided into micro, meso, and macro scales, where the meso scale contains the sensible processes, and the other two are too small and too large, respectively to be perceived, unaided, by the senses. This is natural in light of the fact that science is a branch of knowledge, the objective branch, and it began with what could be sensed and progressed through the technology of instruments and logic.
Often the scale has a profound effect on the nature of successful models, and may prevent models at one scale from having any predictive power at a different scale. Linear models will work here, but not there. Deterministic modeling and stochastic modeling may have to change places.
All the questions involving climate concern macroparameters, and this by definition is the domain of thermodynamics. The key parameters are global averages of the surface temperature, planetary albedo, which throttles the incoming, short wave solar radiation, and the opacity of the greenhouse gases, which resists the outgoing, long wave radiation. All of these parameters are known by estimation, based on sampling, but none is directly measurable. The relationships between the parameters are known by the laws of thermodynamics and conservation, and by thermodynamic models relating heat and capacity.
The IPCC posed macro level questions about Earth, and elected to model the climate by the radiative forcing paradigm using modified weather simulators. The latter are meso scale devices, and have progressed into non-linear and even chaotic (i.e., scientifically worthless) models. To effect their radiative forcing methodology, climatologists first presume that Earth is in a state of equilibrium under natural forces. Then it computes how man perturbs the natural climate by his actions, especially his emission of CO2 into the atmosphere, amplified by the positive feedback of water vapor. Then it assumes the climate response is the sum of these two responses, the natural plus the anthropogenic.
The IPCC's addition of the natural and manmade responses to estimate the climate is an application of the principle of superposition. But superposition applies if and only if the model is linear, and the IPCC admits its models are not linear! The method on its face is not valid. The IPCC cannot bridge the gap to answer its macroparameter questions with mesoscale models. Its modeling effort has demonstrated no predictive power. The work needs to be refocused on accounting for the dominant features of the climate - the quasi-periodic ice ages, interlaced with natural global warming. Until that is demonstrated, and without reliance on superposition, using the models for public policy is unethical.
Much of what is sensible in the weather involves processes far beyond man's power to affect, either to intensify or mitigate. Storms and draughts, floods and dust bowls, extreme heat and cold, exact a terrible toll, and might threaten extinction. These are the phenomena that dominate weather forecasting. They motivate the questions about climate, which is the average background upon which weather rides. The sensible parameters are heat and cold and cloud formations, plus El Niño and La Niña, tornados and, as motivates you, hurricanes. But on the macroscale, the latter are mere eddy currents in the heating and cooling of Earth. These are below the horizon, as we say, irrelevant to the thermodynamics of Earth. Such regional, local, and temporal effects, including the particular distribution of heat in the troposphere as you point out, so far have no predictive value for climate models. They are lost in the large scale averaging into macroparameters.
Your interests in the rain cycle, including the transport of CO2, and the slow oceanic sequestering of carbon are good, but they need to be placed in the context of the question of the day. The IPCC has sounded its public alarm over CO2 using models that are faithful to neither the carbon cycle nor the hydrological cycle, and worse. They have no predictive power.
Even small variations from the Sun would have a major impact on climate. But from what is known for the last million years or so, such variations have not been the climate driver. Nor have the Milankovitch cycles; nor has the greenhouse effect. In my model, ice ages are cloudless, locked by surface albedo. But warm climates are driven by cloud albedo, a high loop gain, negative feedback that mitigates the positive greenhouse effect, including CO2 effects, and even the Milankovitch effect, to smidgens. Cloud albedo thereby stabilizes Earth's more temperate climate, but is itself modulated, most likely by gamma rays coupled with solar cycles.
This would be my opening message to the politicians and the public.]
Posted by W. C. Jordan | July 19, 2008 6:28 AM
Hello again RSJ,
The Earth's climate involves huge forces of sun and ocean and atmospheric content. So surely this 'warming issue' all boils down to how much CO2 is in the atmosphere and how much it can effect temperature?
[RSJ: To say "huge forces of sun and ocean and atmospheric" is to wax poetic. Instead of poets, though, you might want to follow the lead of thermodynamicists. Imagine an envelope around Earth and try to account for everything that passes through that envelope, coming in or going out. The Sun is first in power, followed distantly by gravitational forces and cosmic rays. Neither the ocean nor the atmosphere contribute mass or energy to the reckoning through the envelope, but instead deflect or absorb incoming energy, modulate ancient heat left from Earth's creation and added heat absorbed, and they react to the warming by distributing the absorbed energy in a most complex manner.
[However, the technical issue does not boil down to the CO2, and that is true by a wide margin. It doesn't even boil down to greenhouse gases, notwithstanding that they have a blanket effect that staves off the frozen planet phase of the ice ages.
[Nor does it boil down to the Sun, although a relatively tiny change in solar energy could drive Earth into a state of ice or toast.
[No. What governs our climate within the bounds of our measurements and deductions is albedo, the reflection of solar energy by clouds in the warm and generally livable phases like the present, and by the surface in the frozen states of the ice ages. This is a powerful, dynamic, negative feedback, yet to be modeled in global climate models used to predict catastrophe. It has a latching effect to hold Earth in its existing state, whether cold or warm.
[Because the GCMs don't model dynamic cloud albedo, they incorrectly account for the greenhouse effect. The put the greenhouse effect in open loop. In reality, that loop is closed through cloud albedo. Surface warming increases specific humidity, which then increases cloud cover. This is a dynamic feature of the hydrological cycle, missing in the GCMs which only provide an arbitrary statistical estimate of cloud cover.
[In today's benign climate, changes in the long-term average cloud albedo too small and too obscure to be measured, mitigate warming from any cause by about an order of magnitude. That includes variations in solar power, the Milankovitch effect of distance to the sun, as well as the greenhouse effect. The power of minute changes in albedo to regulate climate against large changes in the concentration of greenhouse gases is easily seen by recognizing that albedo alters incoming solar radiation, which is two orders of magnitude more powerful than the outgoing, longwave radiation from Earth. In control system theory, this is known as the closed loop gain.]
And the parallel question, if you want to move Earth's climate (in particular temperature) you better have some big numbers to effect a big climate [change]!
[RSJ: Except, for example, where a large loop gain exists, as in the case of cloud albedo, as explained above.]
What is so difficult therefore about finding answers or is my question/s totally naive?
CO2 is 0.0038% of Earths atmosphere. That's not 'a big number'. That's a trace element.
[RSJ: More like 0.038%.]
What is CO2's forcing (warming) ability? Its infrared forcing is only 2 small sections of the entire infrared spectrum. Compared to water vapour or Methane, which punch 20 to 40 times their weight, CO2 is a weakling.
So CO2's influence on climate is a tiny trace element that can hit as hard as an ant's eyebrow (sorry for the description, my maths are to follow shortly!).
As there's a Total of 750 Gigatonnes of CO2 in Earths atmosphere, with 6Gt per year attributed to man, surely it's not rocket science to estimate pretty precisely how much this trace element CO2 can affect Earth's temperature (i.e. the Max possible heat CO2 can contain as a greenhouse gas) and also man's contribution?
My amateur kitchen climate science is shameful in this Forum but I'm doing my level best. Thanks for your help :-)
[RSJ: A few more adjustments to your model are needed to answer your questions. Even though the absorption window for CO2 is limited as you suggest, the net effect of CO2 is about one fourth of the greenhouse effect, and the balance is almost entirely due to water vapor. The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) leverages CO2 to have a greater effect by taking into account that global warming increases specific humidity, so its total greenhouse is CO2 plus the added water vapor from the induced warming. This it recognizes, in part correctly, as the positive feedback of water vapor. It recognizes the increased water vapor from global warming, but for the purposes of its added greenhouse effect and not for its added cloud cover effect.
[Another positive feedback that the IPCC ignores is the outgassing of CO2. The ocean is a natural source of CO2 15 times as great as man's fossil fuel emissions. If CO2 were to warm the climate, the ocean surface would also warm, and the flux of CO2 from the ocean would increase. This is a positive feedback caused by the solubility of CO2 in water, which decreases with increasing temperature. Like the cloud cover problem with the GCMs, this effect is not simulated at all. As a result, the GCMs do not correctly simulate either the carbon cycle or, more importantly, the hydrological cycle.
[So, CO2 has a greater effect than you might guess because of the positive feedbacks of reduced solubility and increased water vapor. Increases in these greenhouse gasses always have a net positive effect, but it is much less significant to global warming than one might suspect, to the point of being all but irrelevant, because of the overwhelming negative feedback of cloud cover.
[Within the last half billion years covered by climate studies, atmospheric CO2 has sometimes been as much as 20 times the present level. The reasons are unknown, but no catastrophe ensued. Atmospheric CO2 has repeatedly increased at substantial rates in recovery from ice epochs, again with no runaway effect or perceptible, induced warming. Net, CO2 increases are an effect of global warming, not a cause.
[The answer to your question about the warming computation lies in the climate sensitivity as defined by the IPCC. It defines that parameter to be the rise in global average surface temperature caused by a doubling of CO2. The IPCC gives a best estimate of 3ºC, with a 66% confidence range of 2ºC to 4.5ºC. However, as described above, the IPCC makes these computations using models without CO2 positive feedback from the ocean, with positive feedback of water vapor from the ocean, but without albedo negative feedback.
[In an overdue paper still in the queue for the Rocket Scientists Journal, the open loop climate sensitivity is shown to be about 1.4ºC, falling within an 85% confidence band for the IPCC calculation. That paper also shows that changes in albedo, so small as to be swamped by the noise in modern day albedo measurements, are sufficient to make the climate sensitivity about 0.1ºC with the albedo feedback loop closed.
[In short, CO2 has not been, is not being, and will not be the cause of any more than a trivial global warming.
[P.S. Just moments ago, Denver's Mayor John Hickenlooper was on TV boasting that Denver was proudly doing its bit as the green city host to the green Democratic convention - by cutting carbon dioxide emissions. He sports a pedometer on his belt.
[Mayor, mayor! CO2 is a greening agent. Benign in all other respects, it is an optimum effluent.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | August 6, 2008 10:51 PM
Hello again Dr. Glassman,
Thank you for your previous response, greatly appreciated.
Recently it appears that the Mauna Loa measurements have come in for some more detailed examination / questioning. Namely, as I'm aware at Anthony Watts web blog, Watts up with that? So far the commentary and following discussion has covered three threads. I'll link to the latest thread only, the earlier ones being referenced from this thread.
http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/2008/08/07/mauna-loa-to-improve-the-co2-data/
In particular I noted this post from Dee Norris, in one of the earlier threads.
" The raw data is available from 1974 to 2006 as I posted earlier.
ftp://ftp.cmdl.noaa.gov/ccg/co2/in-situ/mlo/
ftp://ftp.cmdl.noaa.gov/ccg/co2/in-situ/README_insitu_co2.html "
I recall that you have suggested that the raw data from Mauna Loa is not available. (Or the files are too large to download on a normal PC.) Is this the raw data. Are the files still too large. If they are the raw data files in a better format (i.e., downloadable) I thought you should see the link.
I'd appreciate your opinion on this subject.
Thanks in advance,
Derek.
[RSJ:Thanks for the links. The files from NOAA are of a much finer resolution than I had previously discovered. They contain hourly averages of CO2 measurements in separate files for each year, covering 32 years 7 months. That's a total of just over 284 thousand records, which would consume over 4 full Excel columns. That ought to bring Excel to its knees.
[Clearly these are not raw data, though the term "raw data" may be vague and situational. They are not raw because even the hourly figures are averages. A viable criterion for raw data might be the point in the acquisition and reduction at which the data first appear in physical dimensions appropriate to the parameter, such as units of mass fraction. In another investigation, raw might mean transducer outputs in volts or count.
[These records should prove useful to an analysis to extract the diurnal variations in CO2 concentration. For someone with obsessive compulsive data reduction disorder or a lot of spare time, a little scientific treasure might be waiting. However, they are not sufficient to understanding whether calibrations made records from various stations or instruments appear contiguous, nor to understanding whether the seasonal variations observed are due to biosphere respiration and precipitation as opposed to seasonal wind currents coupled with patterns in spatial concentration. Do the data include corrections for Southern Oscillation Index (SOI) (El Niño) conditions, or for volcanic activity?
[These records do not include any wind vector measurements or temperatures. They do show the results of quality control decisions, in particular tags indicating "rejected, diurnal variation (upslope)", but neither a basis nor data for making the decision. The label upslope seems to indicate a wind pattern observation.
[A magnificent amount of work has gone into these records, but sometimes the results and conclusions seem too pat. Suspicions will be resolved only upon full, free, public disclosure, including the reference papers downloadable in text format. That should be done long before another dime is spent on CO2 abatement.]
Posted by Derek | August 8, 2008 1:20 AM
Thank you for your very prompt response, I have "paraphased" it (apologies if I have lost any of the intended meaning / understanding / points, but I sincerely hope I have the basics correct.), and will let you know if the responses are worthwhile reporting back.
Posted by Derek | August 8, 2008 12:20 PM
A response that may be worth noting. (I think you may well already aware of this pdf) A pdf by Dr. Tans explaining how the Mauna Loa data is collected, at present it is supposed to be the most up-to-date available … from 1989 (but admitted as out of date by Dr. Tans):
http://www.catskill.net/denisenorris/ThoningK_JGR89.pdf Atmospheric Carbon Dioxide at Mauna Loa Observatory 2. Analysis of the NOAA GMCC Data, 1974-1985 KIRK W. THONING AND PIETER P. TANS
To understand a statistic, or statistics first you must understand the assumptions behind the statistics.
I noted part of the wording in the paper to the effect that a lot of data is omitted in calculating the averages (which is what is being referred to as "raw data" ?) because of the evenly mixed CO2 assumption....
[RSJ:Thanks for the reference. I had not seen it, and it is informative. It shows that the consideration given to wind in the data reduction was a coarse upslope/downslope qualification. The paper has an interesting reference on wind conditions: Mendonca, B. G., Local wind circulation on the slopes of Mauna Loa, J. Appl. Meteorol., 8, 533-541, 1969. This is available online as a pdf image.
[For several reasons, the AGW model needs atmospheric CO2 to be well-mixed. (This would be the necessary consequence of CO2 being long-lived and so builds in the atmosphere, and it helps with the proposition that MLO measurements are not merely a local phenomenon.) So climatologists make the well-mixed assumption, notwithstanding plain, contradictory evidence in their own reports. The assumption seems to have seduced MLO investigators into ignoring the shifting wind at MLO and its effects on measurements because of the plume of outgassing from the nearby Eastern Equatorial Pacific, whenever that was discovered.
[Thoning shows he gave scant consideration to temperature, in particular to global average temperature and its effect on outgassing. So these documents support the hypothesis that the reduction of the MLO CO2 concentration data has not taken into account the influences of the oceanic outgassing plume.
[Seasonal changes in the MLO CO2 record may be better correlated with wind patterns than with biosphere respiration and precipitation. Charles Keeling attributed the seasonal effects to the latter, and that conclusion persists today in the publications.
[More important are the secular changes which might be occurring because the MLO CO2 record is affected by the temperature dependent intensity of the outgassing plume, and because the location of the plume may be slowly shifting with respect to Mauna Loa. These effects are the most probable cause of the observed increase in CO2 wrongly attributed to fossil fuel burning.
[By the way, Thoning featured the conclusion that 59% of fossil fuels emissions had remained in the atmosphere, and that that accounted for the observed growth rate in MLO CO2 of 1.42 ppm/year over the first 12 years of record keeping. He shows how he based his analysis on the Fossil Fuel Airborne Fraction, which is the ratio of annual CO2 emissions to measured annual CO2 growth rate at MLO. The correlation coefficient between the two measurements is only 45%, yet with nothing more, he treats the Airborne Fraction as if it were an established theory. By using the name Airborne Fraction, the climatologists give the empirical parameter an unwarranted predictive power. That the increase in CO2 is due to man is a conjecture on this evidence (actually, it is false), whether couched in the name Airborne Fraction or not.]
Posted by Derek | August 8, 2008 11:58 PM
I know almost nothing about this, but going over your article and responses, have picked up that there is more than "no consensus" on the cause of climate change, but there are people blocking information. I find with great interest your point about "peer reviewed" journals blocking publication of articles and have found the same in such unrelated fields as medicine and studies in religion! How come our scientific and scholarly journals are getting a bit like the corporate media? They only publish things that don't challenge the status quo? Aside from my comments here, could you recommend a website for a non-rocket scientist, to get started and up to speed on the issues of climate change that isn't biased and one-sided?
[RSJ: A very active campaign is underway to discredit and ridicule anyone who expresses even normal, healthy scientific skepticism about the AGW model. It takes two primary forms: (1) he lacks credentials, or more pointed, he is not a climatologist, or (2) he has not published his claims (or perhaps anything else) in a recognized, peer reviewed journal. Either is sufficient for the defenders to ignore legitimate questions or concerns, and to diss skepticism. For proof, browse through either of these two sites:
http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/campaigns/global-warming-and-energy/exxon-secrets
http://realclimate.org/
[Both are useful resources, but not for the unvaccinated. Greenpeace's Exxon secrets site is not limited to the alleged Exxon conspiracy. You can find some helpful biographies there. You can ignore the fact that so and so might have had funding from an evil corporation, if that's not redundant. After all, Greenpeace makes to effort to black list true believers who have accepted government largesse.
[Realclimate.org is an unabashed, unapologetic apologist for AGW. Some of the authors are actually scientists respected outside the AGW community. The site can be a resource for excellent, though tainted, technical information on a wide range of relevant topics. Many of the articles should be readable by nonscientific professionals. However, bear in mind that authors write to support the tenets of anthropogenic global warming, and tend to respond to meddlers with ad hominem attacks and distortions of their arguments.
[You've set yourself a difficult task. An important starting point would be the Summaries for Policymaker of the IPCC's Third Assessment Report and the Historical Overview of Climate Change Science of its Fourth Assessment Report.
http://www.grida.no/CLIMATE/IPCC_TAR/wg1/005.htm
http://ipcc-wg1.ucar.edu/wg1/Report/AR4WG1_Print_Ch01.pdf
[These summaries are important because there would be no climate crisis but for the IPCC. They are somewhat readable, being written for ordinary legislators and government administrators. The ability to read graphs would be helpful, but a little knowledge of the precepts of science, to which climatology must be subservient, might prove a hindrance.
[If you have any questions, post them here as comments for a considered reply. I do reserve the right to answer in the context of the overarching AGW conjecture, and as reported by IPCC. Climate on this blog is dedicated to debunking the IPCC.
[Here are a couple of websites that responsibly challenge the AGW conjecture and report on progress against the movement:
http://www.climateaudit.org/
http://www.jennifermarohasy.com/blog/
[None of these sources, RealClimate.org, Exxon secrets, climateaudit.org, jennifermarohasy.com, or even the IPCC reports themselves, is peer-reviewed, except via the Internet. To be fair, the IPCC has done a respectable job of subjecting its reports to a panel of experts, and going beyond what journals do in peer-review by publishing the critics' names, the criticisms, and the disposition of each. However, the moderator of these reviews is the author, not an independent publisher allegedly or ostensibly trying to uphold scientific standards. Regardless, the IPCC's draft documents and its published review process constitute a valuable resource in debunking its reports.
[Peer review is a modern and failed phenomenon. It still looms large in academia and in the halls of bureaucracies. But in the fields of science with commercial value, industry employs the majority of PhDs, who make major scientific advances at triple the scholarly pace, but do so under the silence of trade secrets.
[Teach your kids how to read corporate media. When an ad says, "this cleaner never streaks", what does that tell you? Answer: cleaners streak. Two things protect the public from raw advocacy: competition and caution. Information and science literacy are the enemy of charlatans. The Internet, the blogosphere if you will, is proving to be our salvation.
[For more, Google for "Famous papers which were not peer-reviewed", a 2004 article cut from Wikipedia (by peer-review advocates?). It included five key papers by Einstein, and Watson & Crick's paper on the structure of DNA. See also
http://www.wikinfo.org/index.php/Peer_review#Famous_papers_which_were_not_peer-reviewed
[And you might want to review the famous hoax perpetrated by Alan Sokal on the peer review process.
[The hallmark of science is models with predictive power, regardless of whether the algorithm has been published. Predictive power without publication is scientific success. The converse, publication without predictive power, is at best a hypothesis, and more likely a conjecture.
[For evidence of how peer review has become dysfunctional, consider the following:
Richard Horton, editor of the British medical journal The Lancet, has said that "The mistake, of course, is to have thought that peer review was any more than a crude means of discovering the acceptability - not the validity - of a new finding. Editors and scientists alike insist on the pivotal importance of peer review. We portray peer review to the public as a quasi-sacred process that helps to make science our most objective truth teller. But we know that the system of peer review is biased, unjust, unaccountable, incomplete, easily fixed [RSJ: jiggered, not repaired], often insulting, usually ignorant, occasionally foolish, and frequently wrong."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer_review, citing from
http://www.mja.com.au/public/issues/172_04_210200/horton/horton.html.
[How come, you ask? Many professional journals have been hijacked, diverted from science for power, recognition, control, and especially money. Peer review is practiced as rice bowl protection.
[Peer review is not the current method for blocking information about AGW. The infection has spread too far. Peer review is inherently slow enough to impede criticism, even if publication of non-conforming papers were to be allowed. The defense of AGW takes the form of non-engagement through ridicule and ad hominem attacks, plus slick, scary media productions. AGW is no longer part of science. It is a religion and a political movement. It is a belief system. It's Hollywood.]
Posted by Cyrus | August 9, 2008 6:39 PM
Thank you very much once again for your recent reply Dr G.
I understand the solubility pump, CO2 forcing potential and the Vostok record shows CO2 does not have any significant impact on temp.
[RSJ: True enough, but let us not forget that CO2 and global temperature are correlated, but that CO2 is a lagging indicator of the warming. It can't be a significant cause. The IPCC admits as much with the glib excuse that CO2 nonetheless amplifies the initial orbital forcing. TAR, ¶2.4.1, p. 137.]
But I've come across some comments with my limited science background I can't counter. Can you kindly throw some light on these replies (please put in layman's terms if possible) which I believe is AGW advocates just trying to blind (bamboozle) the public with scientific language.
In a Guardian article, green journalist George Monbiot trashes Lord Chris Monkton's claim the IPCC have exaggerated the warming effects of CO2 when Monkton claimed: "'the UN repealed a fundamental physical law', doubling the size of the constant (lambda) in the Stefan-Boltzmann equation. By assigning the wrong value to lambda, the UN's panel has exaggerated the sensitivity of the climate to extra carbon dioxide. … [Lord Monkton's] claims the Stefan-Boltzmann equation have been addressed by someone who does know what he's talking about, Dr. Gavin Schmidt of NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies. He begins by pointing out that Stefan-Boltzmann is a description of radiation from a 'black body' - an idealised planet that absorbs all the electromagnetic radiation that reaches it. The Earth is not a black body. It reflects some of the radiation it receives back into space."
[RSJ: I found George Monbiot's article, dated 11/14/06, at your link, and it contains your quotation. I also found a paper by Monckton published in the Sunday Telegraph on 11/5/06.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1533290/Climate-chaos-Don%27t-believe-it.html
[It contains Monbiot's quotation attributed to Monckton. But here Monbiot collapsed, falsely attributing to Monckton the claim that the UN doubled "the size of the constant (lambda) in the Stefan-Boltzmann equation" (quoting Monbiot).
[The constant in the Stefan-Boltzmann Law, cleverly called the Stefan-Boltzmann Constant, is conventionally designated by the lower case Greek letter sigma, σ. No one suggested this constant had been altered. Monckton said that the S-B Law was used to compute lambda (the link to his calculations no longer works), and that when the UN doubled lambda, it had "effectively repealed the law". What Monckton referred to was indeed lambda, λ, but that is climate sensitivity, a different parameter.]
Schmidt replies Monckton forgets, in making his calculations, that "climate sensitivity is an equilibrium concept": in other words that there is a time-lag of several decades between the release of carbon dioxide and the eventual temperature rise it causes. If you don't take this into account, the climate's sensitivity to carbon dioxide looks much smaller. This is about as fundamental a mistake as you can make in climate science.
What is 'lambda' and is Schmidt arguing CO2 stores up and saves heat for decades? Sounds ridiculous!
[RSJ: Monbiot's error made your question about lambda ambiguous. First, σ is a constant that relates the energy radiated from a black body according to its temperature. Its units, Watts/square meter per degree Kelvin to the fourth power, give you clues to its meaning and something of the relation between temperature and power. See the article in Wikipedia titled "Stefan-Boltzmann law", noting that a Joule per second, J s -1 is the same as one Watt.
[Second, λ is climate sensitivity, a parameter in ºC per Watt m -2 which the IPCC defines several different ways. As it's units suggest, it is the rate of change of global average surface temperature to a change in radiation power through the atmosphere. TAR, ¶6.2.1, p. 354. It also defines an "equilibrium climate sensitivity", and an "effective climate sensitivity", determined before equilibrium. TAR, Glossary, p. 789. Further, the IPCC Reports regularly use climate sensitivity simply in ºC, in which case it refers to climate forcing attributed to a doubling of atmospheric CO2 concentration. TAR, passim.
[I couldn't verify Gavin's claim that Monckton erred with respect to the equilibrium nature of climate sensitivity. The error was not apparent to me in his article, and his calculations could not be downloaded. Regardless, Gavin has no basis for his claim in light of the ambiguity in the IPCC definition of climate sensitivity.
[Gavin surely didn't mean that CO2 stores up and saves heat. What he refers to is that climate models compute a new equilibrium point for each set of forcings, but that they gradually approach that new point by computational iterations. This is not to be confused with the reaction time of the climate, which would require emulating the heat capacity of the various elements. Instead, this is the reaction time of the computers, and the intermediate solutions do not have any particular physical meaning. At first, the climatologists were not able to predict the equilibrium point without letting the models run to equilibrium. Now they can, so they employ the "effective climate sensitivity". Gavin may be suggesting that Monckton erroneously used an intermediate point in the computer response instead of the final equilibrium point. How Monckton might have had access to such a datum is not at all obvious.
[Monbiot's references to Gavin Schmidt relate well enough to Gavin's article of 11/9/06, "Cuckoo Science". It is available at
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/11/cuckoo-science/
[Gavin introduces Monckton as a man "with obviously too much time on his hands". Then Gavin conflates two articles, adding a piece from Steve Malloy's Junk Science blog. From there, Gavin gratuitously explains something that Monckton did not claim: that Earth is not a black body. Gavin says,
So here's the first trick. Ignore all the feedbacks - then you will obviously get to a number that is close to the 'black body' calculation. Duh! Any calculation that lumps together water vapour and CO2 is effectively doing this … .
[His straw man error he attributes to Monckton leads Gavin down the slippery slope of the gravest of IPCC errors, about as fundamental a mistake as one can make in climate science. It's hard to know where to start.
[The IPCC makes clear that the "climate system is highly nonlinear". This is riddled with misconceptions. Linearity is a property of models, not the real world. It is a mathematical property, and a system, set of equations, or whatever, is either linear or not. Nonlinearity does not come in degrees, as in more or less nonlinear, or highly so. Several definitions of system linearity are available and equivalent. One particularly applicable definition is that a model is linear if and only if the output in response to two sources is the sum of the outputs in response to each source taken separately.
[In one sense, the IPCC can be excused because in the vernacular of science, a conversational claim that a system is nonlinear would be taken to mean that the model for the system is not linear. However, the model that the IPCC constructs for the climate features right at the outset a linear property. The radiative forcing paradigm assumes that without the influence of man, Earth's climate is in equilibrium. Then in response to the natural state of climate drivers (forcings), it computes a response due to man, and adds the two responses. Because its model is admittedly nonlinear, no reason exists to expect the anthropogenic forcing to be additive.
[And that is only the tip of that iceberg. Apparently, the IPCC presumes that the natural state, that is, the preindustrial global state, had no temperature rise. Its models do not seem to calculate the warming due to recovery from the last major and minor ice ages (millions, tens of thousands, and centuries ago), and then they compute warming due to man. As a result, the natural warming of those epochs would seem to be credited to man, if the IPCC models make any sense at all.
[Gavin ridicules the IPCC critics for some alleged offense with regard to feedbacks ignored. In particular, he accuses these critics of AGW of ignoring something about water vapor and CO2 loops. These involve the hydrological and carbon cycles, respectively, neither of which the IPCC models correctly. As the surface warms, the ocean emits more CO2. Since CO2 is a greenhouse gas, the additional CO2 tends to warm the atmosphere. The IPCC does not model this effect. It does not reproduce the warming effect it admits exists in the Vostok record, but which it chalks up to an unproved amplifying effect.
[The IPCC recognizes that warming causes the ocean to increase atmospheric water vapor, the most significant greenhouse gas of all. Indeed, it is this positive feedback by which the IPCC models manage to create the large warming effect it attributes to CO2. What the IPCC does not do, however, is increase cloud cover and thereby increase cloud albedo as the water vapor increases. This is a powerful negative feedback. It is the feedback that regulates Earth's temperature against warming from any source. It mitigates the effect of solar fluctuations, of the Milankovitch cycles, and especially for the AGW model, the greenhouse effect.
[Cloud albedo is a shutter on the extreme power of the Sun: 1370 W m-2 at Earth. Greenhouse gases by comparison regulate 390 W m-2 at 14ºC, which would be 33ºC cooler without the greenhouse effect. My simulation shows that an albedo change much smaller than the accuracy with which albedo is known will mitigate the greenhouse effect by a factor of 10.
[Whether the critics of AGW have erred or not is irrelevant. It is the IPCC and Gavin Schmidt who have erred on feedbacks. Their climate sensitivity is due to greenhouse gas with some positive feedback loops closed (good), but in open loop with respect to cloud albedo (very bad). Because of the strength of the albedo negative feedback, the IPCC models the greenhouse effect essentially open loop.]
Link to Guardian article.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/nov/14/science.comment
I also ran across some posts on RealClimate written by Eric Steig commenting on Al Gore being cross-examined by Congressman Joe Barton on getting his CO2 lag ahead of Temp (just a 'minor' inaccuracy!) he writes "… those who've been paying attention will recognize that Gore is not wrong at all ... . On historical timescales, CO2 has definitely led, not lagged, temperature."
How can Mr. Steig claim such 'anti-science' like this?
After the Steig article a poster called John (no relation to me) posted, "It would appear that the actual CO2 levels are rather impotent as an amplifier either way ... warming or cooling."
Jeff (no relation to you I presume!) Severinghaus from RealClimate replies, "… it is not logical to argue that, because CO2 does not cause the first thousand years or so of warming, nor the first thousand years of cooling, it cannot have caused part of the many thousands of years of warming in between. … The contribution of CO2 to the glacial-interglacial coolings and warmings amounts to about one-third of the full amplitude, about one-half if you include methane and nitrous oxide."
RealClimate Post 77 says, "As you might be rightfully aware, according to Takahashi measurements of global CO2 fluxes from oceans, they outgas about 100GT of carbon per year in tropical areas. Thank you for boiling this post down to its bones. [¶] The oceans give off about 90 gigatons of carbon altogether per year, and absorb 92 gigatons. They are presently a sink for carbon dioxide, not a source. The recent increase in carbon dioxide has come about from fossil fuel burning and land-use changes."
[RSJ: This sink vs. source gaff is too big to ignore. The ocean is a sink for atmospheric CO2 all across its surface and wherever the waters cool. That cooling causes an uptake in CO2. In a couple of places, the ocean is a major source of CO2, the dominant one being in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific. A huge river of CO2 circles the globe in perpetuity, or a least until the next ice age.]
RealClimate Link.
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2007/04/the-lag-between-temp-and-co2/
You answered recently my question CO2 is accredited with about 20% of greenhouse warming. I've also seen water vapour accredited with 90-95% of warming. And I've just seen a Facebook recording of Australian scientists (anti-AGW) who stated the University of Chicago estimate the first 22 ppm of atmospheric CO2 has the greatest warming impact, more so than the next 400 ppm in total put together. You've also mentioned the decline of influence in CO2 as its atmospheric volume increases. Can you explain how this works - why the CO2 forcing is not linear with increased volume - please?
[RSJ: Imagine that we had an instrument that would let us visualize the radiation emitted from Earth, giving it the faux color spectrum of the rainbow laid across the band of black body emissions. And further imagine that we could create such images by varying the atmosphere. With no atmosphere, the radiation would appear faint in the reds and oranges, strong in the yellows and greens, and weak again in the blues in violets. Now we put the atmosphere back, and the radiation has next to nothing in the reds and oranges, nor in the blues and violets. It would be dominantly greens and yellows, with a little weakness, a hole, on the yellow side of the greens. Now we experiment by adding and subtracting the gases in the atmosphere. Almost all the attenuation in the reds, blues, and violets and about half the attenuation in the orange was due to water vapor. The little weakness on the yellow side of the greens was due to oxygen.
[In this not too imaginary imaging, we can measure a strong CO2 effect in the violets, but Earth didn't have much radiation there anyway. Carbon dioxide had a strong effect in the orange region, which water vapor had already reduced by about half. So if we increased the concentration of CO2, we could cut off only what little was left of the oranges.
[Remember, these were faux colors, but it should give you the correct idea. Very dense but still practical CO2 can have no more effect than to absorb what's left of the faux orange. We're dealing with the spectrum of radiation, and the absorption spectra of the various gases, and sometimes described in terms of windows.
[For a nice set of diagrams on the process, visit Wikipedia, Radiation Transmitted by the Atmosphere, at
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Atmospheric_Transmission.png
[Otherwise, I can't vouch for the various numbers you quoted. I wouldn't want to waste much time on them because the greenhouse effect is mitigated by Earth's albedo, and CO2 plays a minor role in the GH effect.
Finally I'm still trying to button down the actual mechanical figures of CO2 (Tons in the atmospheric reservoir and the Tonnage in and out of the sources and sinks). There seems no definitive source (incl. the IPCC) for say the Annual average figures for say 1900 to 2008 though we do have the Annual percentage changes. The below is the best I've found to date but far from complete. Do you know of any sources accessible online?
Thank you once again for your help :)
CO2 Chart - Years 1700 to 2000
http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/siple-gr.htm
Source.
http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/siple.htm
http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/contents.htm
[RSJ: No, I don't know of a better source. The reservoir and flux figures are by analysis, not measurement, so you shouldn't find values by year.
[There would be no climate crisis but for the IPCC. Congressmen and the President are not going to read technical journals or data repositories on much of anything. By the same token, alternative models to the IPCC's or alternative data don't matter either. Even if the IPCC adopted a model incorrectly, or got the data wrong, the only thing that counts is how the IPCC finally interpreted the things it relied upon, or selectively omitted. The IPCC, along with its AGW conjecture, needs to be debunked based on its own writings. The evidence for that debunking is abundant.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | August 14, 2008 8:21 PM
Just reading some above posts 3 more issues arise. There's a 'missing' 3 Gt per Year sink for CO2 according to IPCC.
1). Could it be in surface ice (Antarctic, Arctic, Glaciers) and snow (mountain snow) ?
[RSJ: At one time, the IPCC denied the existence of the missing sink (TAR, ¶3.5.1, p. 208), then later sort of resurrected it by renaming it the "residual land sink" (4AR, ¶7.3.2.2.3, p. 520).
[The IPCC model contains two aspects which are difficult to take seriously. One is the notion of radiative forcing, which creates a linear, additive temperature increase to a "highly nonlinear" system. The other is the linear idea of the net of anything, in particular, net fluxes of CO2.
[The IPCC reckons that the flux of CO2 to leaf water is about 270 PgC/yr, terrestrial Gross Primary Product is about 120 PgC/yr (which may come out of leaf water), and ocean flux is 90 or so GtC/yr. So the total is at least 360 GtC/yr, over 50 times what the IPCC calculates for man's emissions. Assume that the standard deviation error in these figures is about 20%. Then the standard deviation of net difference between two such values is the square root of the sum of the squares of the two component standard deviations. So a 20% one sigma error in 100 GtC/yr is 20 GtC/yr, and the net of two such numbers has its own one sigma error of 28 GtC/yr. That's a huge error when considering a missing sink of 3 or so GtC/yr, or a net ACO2 increase of 2 or 3 GtC/yr. What's missing, or even of interest, is lost in the noise.
[To defend its chosen radiative forcing paradigm, the IPCC must suffer the classic problem of tyros of calculating the small differences between large numbers. It should have known better from elementary principles of science.]
Which is a result of my 2 other questions:
2). Vostok and other ice cores measure atmospheric CO2 trapped/laid down in the Arctic/Antarctic regions. If cold ocean absorbs CO2 under partial pressure (wind) cannot surface ice (namely does frozen water restrict/prevent CO2 absorption)?
[RSJ: The ocean absorbs CO2 progressively as surface currents move poleward under the influence of the surface currents, called gyres. The surface cooling continues to the poles where seawater approximately in equilibrium with sea ice, cold and dense, descends as the headwaters of the thermohaline circulation. Wind has been shown to enhance the absorption, but the absorption is inexorable. Absorption is caused by the kinetic energy of the particles under partial pressure.
[Partial pressure is defined only for a mixture of gases. Conventionally, dissolved gas is "said" to have a partial pressure. The partial pressure is equivalent to the gas concentration on the atmospheric side if at equilibrium. The gas in solution tends to escape from the ocean to the atmosphere in proportion to the temperature of the ocean, and to reenter the surface waters in proportion to the concentration or partial pressure in the atmosphere above the ocean. This is Henry's Law of solubility.
[When the solution is frozen, the whole of the kinetics changes. Now the physics of diffusion and Fick's Laws apply. The word diffusion may be used for both processes. I am unaware of Fick's diffusion coefficient ever being determined for CO2 and ice, but surely it's an extraordinarily slow process. Some CO2 can escape from the trapped bubbles in the ice pack, but the answer to your question is yes, ice terminates the solubility process.
3). If ice can absorb CO2 does it do so in heavier concentrations than ocean (as according to the CO2 solubility increasing with lower temp) and therefore effect the accuracy of Vostok type measurements?
[RSJ: Liquid water is remarkably receptive to CO2, and ice is surely quite impervious to it. And I would be amazed if the reduction of ice core data did not take into account losses of CO2 due to diffusion.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | August 14, 2008 9:29 PM
Thank you so much for the crystal clear explanation of the CO2 forcing diminishing past 22 ppm.
If this is proven, and the next 400 ppm or even next 600-900 ppm has little additional warming effect it is surely the end of the AGW and CO2 argument?
How can the IPCC possibly ignore this science in their next Report, in their global computer models (have any factored this in yet?) and not reach the conclusion CO2 cannot possibly be responsible for the warming seen since 1940 and cannot possibly be a threat to future warming?
Debate over for any honourable scientist and unsustainable for the dishonourable ones and with it the politicians living in a scientific vacuum!
[RSJ: The absorption spectra of greenhouse gases have been well-known for most of a century. The IPCC just skipped over the phenomenon in its Reports to conclude that, by itself, CO2 can't have a frightening enough effect on climate. The IPCC model instead rationalizes that the additional warming caused by the CO2, feeble as it is, is enhanced (increased to favor its AGW conjecture) by the release of additional water vapor, the greatest greenhouse gas. This is the positive feedback side of water vapor. See TAR, ¶1.3.1, subheading "The enhanced greenhouse effect", p. 93. In fact, the IPCC refers to the "positive water vapour feedback", by which it means the net effect of water vapor in response to forcings. Id., ¶7.2.1 Physics of the Water Vapour and Cloud Feedbacks, p. 423.
[Until last year, the IPCC concept was that the climate is unstable. In its Third Assessment Report, the climate could be upset by a little nudge, and then run away to a catastrophic state. That nudge might have been orbital variations, and the accelerant was CO2. Such unstable systems are just not found in nature. The Delicate Blue Planet is poetry, not science.
[In its Fourth Assessment Report, the IPCC introduced the concept of tipping points, which encompasses the more plausible view that the climate is conditionally stable. Now the nudge is some unpredictable amount of CO2. The climate indeed is likely to have multiple, conditionally stable points, as in the ice ages versus the modern era, and in varying stable states postulated for the thermohaline circulation. These processes are what need to be modeled. For each possible upsetting forcing, what is the margin for stability? This requires an analysis of the existing state of the climate, not of the forward looking change in climate from the present state.
[The radiative forcing paradigm of the IPCC global climate models assumes equilibrium before industrial man, then seeks to assess additive changes. That alleged initial state is what needs to be quantified and understood.
[What the IPCC has failed to grasp is the importance of cloud cover in response to added water vapor, and its high-gain, dominating effect on climate through cloud albedo. The IPCC does not use the concept of closed loop gain, and indeed its radiative forcing model may be unsuitable for assessing gain. The IPCC does recognize that its representation of cloud cover is perhaps the greatest failing of its GCMs. That admission of an inadequate representation of the hydrological cycle is honorable. What the IPCC ignored is its ethical obligation to repair this hole, among others, in its modeling before foisting its conjecture on the public.
[A scientific model must advance past conjectures and hypotheses to the level of a theory before scientists can use it ethically for public policy. This is not to say that conjectures or hypotheses are not sometimes worthy of public funding. In those instances, the objective is to advance some promising but limited knowledge to the level of a theory through non-trivial prediction and validation. Once it is a theory, its practicality can be assessed for measured public action or reaction.
[The AGW conjecture is not even a hypothesis because it fails to fit all the data in its domain. Backward looking, it is falsified on several points. For example, it fails to account for the ice ages, even qualitatively. For another, it fails to account for the natural carbon cycle. It fails to simulate dynamic cloud albedo. And it fails to include the background of the on-going global warming in recovery from the last major and minor cold epochs.
[It is also not a hypothesis because it is not verifiable. The IPCC fails to make a non-trivial, novel prediction, other than its ultimate prediction of catastrophic global warming, by which its model might be validated. Using the AGW conjecture to institute a global reduction in carbon is unethical.
[The meaning of your last sentence isn't clear, but the honorable thing for scientists to do is to speak out against the IPCC and the AGW movement beginning with first principles.]
[For a recent example of just such an honorable response, addressed directly to the UN, I commend the 12/12/07 open letter to the Secretary-General by 100 Prominent Scientists. http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/reprint/UN_open_letter.pdf.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | August 21, 2008 10:22 PM
Dear Dr Glassman,
Ferdinand Engelbeen has a lot of useful information (and links) regarding CO2 measurements on his website: http://www.ferdinand-engelbeen.be/klimaat/co2_measurements.html For example, he presents graphs showing that exclusion of 'outlier' measurements of atmospheric CO2 at Mauna Loa makes virtually no difference to the overall trend.
[RSJ: Note that The Acquittal of CO2 here acknowledged Engelbeen, and credited him as the source for Figure 5. Engelbeen's result, which he found remarkable linear, in fact was curved enough to point to the fact that the Vostok CO2 and temperature data carry the signature of solubility. ]
Of interest is a graph he includes of CO2 measurements at Diekirch (Luxembourg) indicating that the measured values vary by over 150 ppm depending on wind speed (http://meteo.lcd.lu/papers/co2_patterns/co2_patterns.html, fig. 8). This particular station is regarded as unsuitable for measuring the 'background' level as it is located in a valley with forests and urbanization.
[RSJ: Engelbeen shows the scatter of CO2 concentration with wind speed. He reports on the selection of Mauna Loa data based on wind direction. How can the investigators pretend to record precision atmospheric measurements without recording the wind vector for each data point? Of course, the wind wouldn't matter much if the atmosphere were well mixed. It isn't, and the IPCC Reports show that it isn't notwithstanding its necessary claim that it is.
[Engelbeen's source by Massen et al (at your link) shows data being collected simultaneously with the wind vector using two co-located anemometers. The conclusion in that paper shows the wide ranging results that can be discerned from the data when the wind vector is also known. I would quibble with Massen et al only on the validity of the assumption that Mauna Loa is an isolated reference station.
[In answer to Engelbeen's inquiry, Pieter Tans referred to a 1959 work by Thoning. It is likely this: Thoning, K.W., Selection of NOAA/GMCC CO2 data from Mauna Loa Observatory, In The Statistical Treatment of CO2 Data Records, NOAA Tech. Mem. (ERL ARL 173), Environ. Res. Lab., 131 pp., 1989. It can be found at
http://gaw.kishou.go.jp/wdcgg/products/cd-rom/cd_11/A/archive/document/noaaco2.txt
[But this reference is all about method and not about wind data recording.
[The CO2 concentration various around the globe in patterns that are seasonal, secular, and stationary. What appeared to Keeling to be biosphere seasonal effects were quite likely background CO2 variations modulated by seasonal wind patterns. Without wind data, this is a hypothesis that is difficult to test.]
Engelbeen states: "Background CO2 levels can be found over all oceans and over land at 1000 m and higher altitudes (in high mountain ranges, this may be higher)." But Anthony Watts presents a map showing CO2 concentrations at an altitude of 8 km in July 2003 as measured by the AIRS instrument on the Aqua satellite. The concentration ranges from about 365 to 382 ppm, and it seems quite possible that variations at the surface would be even higher. The AIRS team recognizes that its findings are at variance with mainstream thinking about CO2 being well mixed, and is still validating its results. See:
http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?s=mixed+signals
http://wattsupwiththat.wordpress.com/?s=encouraging+response
[RSJ: The NASA AIRS chart is colorful, but why isn't the Eastern Equatorial Pacific outgassing more intense? The writer mentions that volcanic activity seems to be missing, but ignores the oceanic outgassing. Its flux is about 15 times as great as man's emissions, and far more localized. Unless there's a problem comparing concentration with flux, the region southeast of Hawaii should be beyond bright red. It appears so on the Takahashi flux diagram of AR4 Figure 7.8, p. 523.
[The mid-troposphere (500mb) map for CO2 does indicate the outgassing hotspot, but the picture resolution is not the best. See Watt's link to http://www-airs.jpl.nasa.gov/Science/ResearcherResources/MeetingArchives/TeamMeeting20060307/2006_03_07/Chahine-INTRO-Final.pdf
[The NASA AIRS chart is from 2003. Did it not get even an honorable mention in the IPCC Fourth Assessment Report, Climate Change 2007, because it was only recently prepared and released?
[The IPCC's necessary well-mixed assumption is disproved by the ultimate authority for debunking AGW: the IPCC's own Reports. One Report notes at least a detectable east-west gradient to CO2, and that its north-south gradient is an order of magnitude greater. The Reports show evidence of the intense outgassing near Mauna Loa, but give no consideration to the plume effects on Mauna Loa records. I dispute the existence of any valid "mainstream thinking" on this subject.
[So we should rely on the Takahashi diagram, and not the extraneous data from NASA that the IPCC ignored.
[The author also didn't do his homework as to the alleged agreement by both sides on the AGW question. Each of the four papers so far on this blog disparage the well-mixed assumption. See for example RSJ response to sunsettommy of 11/26/07 in Gavin Schmidt's Response to the Acquittal of CO2 Should Sound the Death Knell for AGW.
[As to the other questions you raise, the Anthropogenic Global Warming problem deals with macroparameters. These include the surface temperature, Earth's albedo, and the greenhouse gas concentrations, all global averages. These are abstract concepts, not directly measurable, but nonetheless amenable to modeling, and even the simplest of models, and subject to governance by thermodynamic principles and laws.
[At the next, finer level of resolution are the sensible parameters of local and regional weather in three dimensions. These are hugely complex, and have defied assemblage into a global climate model at the level of a theory (as opposed to a conjecture or hypothesis, if you've not been following the RSJ approach).
[So while the distribution of gases and heat above the surface, or in the reaches of distant canyons, are interesting topics for study, they have little bearing on the AGW question. That is especially the case if the IPCC has not relied on such data, or explicitly ignored them when they were relevant.
[However, special remarks are in order for the question of wind speed because it affects solubility, a topic all but ignored by the IPCC. For example, the last two IPCC Assessment Reports apparently never mention Henry's Law or Henry's Constant for CO2. The IPCC refers to the well-known solubility pump as the "solution pump".
[Wind has a substantial and well-known effect on the rate of uptake of CO2. However, this is another local example, perhaps vital at the cell level of a GCM, but not significant at all on the macroparameter scale. Surface currents off-load CO2 eventually by outgassing in the warm waters of the Pacific, with an additional minor source in the Indian Ocean. From there, the waters course their way poleward along the western side of the gyres, cooling and loading again with atmospheric CO2. At the end where the currents descend as the headwaters of the thermohaline circulation, they are ice water, saturated with CO2. How each parcel of water might have acquired its load of CO2, quickly or slowly at the whims of the wind and temperature along the way, is random and immaterial to the outgassing because the end point is the same.]
Engelbeen sets out the arguments used to support the view that fossil fuel burning is the main cause of the increase in CO2 since the industrial revolution. A brief summary of his main points:
1. Humans currently emit about 7 GtC/yr, but atmospheric CO2 is increasing by about 4 GtC/yr, implying that natural sources play little or no role in the increase; natural CO2 sinks have been larger than natural CO2 sources for the past 50 years. [this seems to be a statement of belief rather than of fact]
[RSJ: The implication is unfounded, and wrong based either on physics or on logic. Taking everything at face value, the ACO2 certainly more than accounts for the atmospheric increase, but that is far from the same as being the cause of the increase. The argument is mere single point bookkeeping.
[Suppose the natural sources increased at the same time by say, 7 GtC/yr, and the natural sinks increased by 10 GtC/yr. The bookkeeping is the same, and the increase would be 50:50 natural and ACO2.
[Or, suppose the ocean channeled natural CO2 sources directly to the natural sinks, and thus the natural sink had surplus capacity to take in three sevenths of the ACO2. An illogical, but sufficient priority system would be in operation. The sinks have no way to discriminate between nCO2 and ACO2, even hypothesizing a fractionating Henry's Law, and the two gases are irreversibly mixed in the air. Two molecules of CO2 with the same isotopic weight are indistinguishable, regardless of the source. And to the first and second order, most processes are insensitive to isotopic weight.
[The IPCC determined that CO2 in the ocean is subject to at least three different lifetimes, short for awhile, then medium, then dreadfully long. Thus it necessarily implies that CO2 molecules age, that each molecule has a tag by which it switches from one lifetime to another. Perhaps it envisions that CO2 molecules come with a double coating like an enteric tablet. It has the ocean discriminating between old molecules, slowly being sequestered, and new molecules getting the swift treatment. Except where weight matters, all CO2 molecules are alike chemically and physically, and they have no memory.
[Back to Engelbeen, his first argument silently rests on the well-mixed hypothesis. His data appear to be Mauna Loa measurements, and not necessarily global data. The IPCC reports that investigators calibrated the other sites to match the Mauna Loa measurements. Mauna Loa as you suggest has influences of the volcano, but also of El Niño, and apparently the investigators calibrated or adjusted these effects out of their data. Meanwhile MLO sits in the wandering, variable plume of the Eastern Equatorial Pacific outgassing. And al the time, Earth is warming (an essential tenet to the AGW conjecture), causing the natural outgassing to increase (which the IPCC nowhere computes).]
2. The correlation between human emissions and the increase in atmospheric CO2 since 1992 gives an R^2 of 0.997. The atmospheric increase is about 0.55% of human emissions, and there is no known natural process that is able to force CO2 into the atmosphere exactly at the same constant rate. [isn't there?]
[RSJ: Amazing! But, alas, not believable. Do you have a reference?
[The odds are the number was calculated without well-founded detrending. I'd wager it got no detrending at all, making the result quite meaningless. As a minimum the records should have been detrended by the mean and a linear trend line. Better, perhaps, would be detrending by the growth history of ACO2 for the period.
[As shall be shown on this blog by and by, none of the reasons the IPCC gives for the rise in CO2 being anthropogenic is valid. Worse, the IPCC has manipulated the data to give the false impression of cause and effect. Still, the reasons for the measured increase are little more than informed conjectures, and the data are too pat and suspicious. The problem of the climate is not solved.
[As will be shown, the effect of ACO2 on the increase in atmospheric CO2 concentration is analogous to the greenhouse effect on global surface temperature. In each case, the hypothesized cause is correlated with the companion observation. The observation does increase as the alleged cause increases, but the IPCC exaggerates the response by roughly an order of magnitude.]
3. The d13C levels in both the atmosphere and the upper oceans have been decreasing since 1850, as would be expected from anthropogenic emissions. The oceans cannot be the cause of the increase in atmospheric CO2 as their d13C content is too high. [probably too simplistic judging by what you've said about isotope ratios so far]
[RSJ: Can you supply a reference for surface ocean d13C? The IPCC compares atmospheric d13C only with the rate of CO2 emissions. It doesn't even supply a mass balance computation. More on this to come.
4. Vegetation is not the cause of the increase in atmospheric CO2, as data since the 1990s show there is a deficiency in oxygen use from fossil fuel burning; vegetation must be a net sink. [how certain are these data?]
It looks like Engelbeen neglects the huge uncertainties in our understanding of the carbon budget; the IPCC's AR4 (fig. 7.3) gives error margins of +/-20% for the various fluxes. I understand you're going to publish more about isotope ratios in the future.
Engelbeen does not discuss the issue of CO2 residence time. But whatever the residence time, if CO2 is being added to the atmosphere faster than it is being removed, the CO2 concentration will rise. Since natural and anthropogenic CO2 emissions quickly become inseparably mixed, would you expect the same percentage of both streams to contribute to the overall increase in atmospheric CO2? Perhaps more accurate isotope data will one day be able to discriminate between IPCC and alternative models.
[RSJ: Yes. In general, each species will receive the same, geometry sensitive fate throughout the carbon cycle. Natural CO2 and ACO2 are made of the same isotopes, even though ACO2 is supposed to have no 14C. Each has its own ratio of the three. They mix in the atmosphere to produce yet another ratio. Some plants are known to fractionate (preferring one isotope over another) and some investigators suggest that some processes are molecular weight dependent. But these processes are high order and well in the noise. The ability to measure the isotopes is already sufficient to reject the hypothesis that the drop in atmospheric d13C is caused by the addition of ACO2, and with it, the hypothesis that the build up in the atmospheric CO2 is caused by slower ACO2 uptake by any sink.]
When temperature starts to rise at the beginning of an interglacial, doesn't outgassing of CO2 from the oceans start to increase straight away? Why would seawater have to make a complete circuit of the ocean conveyor before it can outgas enough CO2 to produce a marked increase in atmospheric concentration?
[RSJ: Good observation and excellent question. Both uptake and outgassing depend on solubility, for which the two primary parameters are the current temperature of the water and the current partial pressure of the CO2 in the air. In my model, the THC CO2 concentration would be determined by the saturation curve at 0ºC to 4ºC. The uptake of CO2 in the THC is independent of the global average temperature, so the outgassing has no temperature memory. The story is different with partial pressure. When atmospheric CO2 is changing on the scale of a millennium, the outgassing concentration will be lagging the present change. It has a memory of the pressure at the time of its initial descent. This apparently is enough to be measurable in the Vostok record. For more, see the upcoming paper.]
I would value any comments you would like to make on these issues.
Regards,
David
[RSJ: Thanks for the table corrections.]
Posted by David | August 24, 2008 6:28 AM
Yes, I've read the letter sent to the UN Secretary General, Ban Ki-Moon, by 100 scientists. It was sent the month he enjoyed a jolly to Chile and helicopter ride over Antarctica (Nov '07) and came back saying he now believed, more than ever before, that a global calamity awaited us if we did not act!
I don't know who his tour guides were but the 2007 IPCC Report that landed on his desk earlier in the year states quite clearly Antarctica hasn't changed temperature in the last 50 years! Maybe he doesn't read his own UN IPCC Reports?
Your explanation of what is and isn't included in the IPCC's GCMs suggests scientists worldwide need to 'lobby' (more effectively) the IPCC for the inclusion of missing basic climate science.
How big factors like the radiative forcing of CO2 and its limits around 22 ppm can be 'skipped' and the cloud albedo 'omitted' for any scientific body serious about researching climate is disturbing.
What mechanism is there for the representation of such factors (or adjustment) into the IPCC's considerations?
The problem with the IPCC as stated in many quarters of the scientific community is from the outset the IPCC was a political animal. The science is only half the story. The IPCC authors (political appointees) have been accused, even by IPCC's own scientists, of making-up script in the Reports with cursory references to the science presented to the body.
It needs political will at the UN to change this situation and realisation in public the IPCC predictions are not really worth the paper they're written on until important factors are included in their GCMs. The majority of governments (China, India, Russia, etc.) outside of Europe do not believe in this AGW theory.
They appear to be 'the easiest route' of countries the scientific community to lobby for changes at the IPCC.
[RSJ: The IPCC is a servant of the UN, trusted by the Secretary General, whoever might hold the post. Nothing external is likely to break that trust. Nor does the Secretary General appear to have any duty to guarantee the quality or integrity of UN agency reports, nor even to act upon them. He can't be lobbied.
[Published, peer reviewed articles in professional journals take no significant exception to the IPCC reports. Many of these papers are available in the archives of government or quasi-government agencies around the world.
[The IPCC Assessment Reports are huge and complex, filled to the brim with a background of mind-numbing but solid science. High placed political figures can't be expected to read these Reports, much less comprehend them. An especially well developed scientific literacy might be sufficient in individuals to recognize that what is being advanced as science is at best a conjecture. However, discovering the fatal flaws in AGW is too much to expect of any figure in government or his staff.
[Take for example the cloud albedo problem. If the AGW advocates hiding behind the IPCC and peer review were to surface to answer this challenge, they would say that cloud albedo is thoroughly discussed in the IPCC Reports. They would point to treatments of the cloud formation by aerosols (perhaps the best written and researched sections in the Reports), to the greenhouse effect of clouds, to the reflectivity of clouds at different levels in the atmosphere, and to the representation of cloud cover by parameterization, all reflected in their global climate models. It takes scientific training, research, and some reading between the lines to discover that notwithstanding what has been included, none of these GCMs reproduce the strong negative feedback of cloud albedo. They do not model the dynamics of cloud cover in response to the higher specific humidity caused by global warming, whatever the source.
[Political will to resist is pointless at the U.N. It is needed instead wherever the next step is contemplated to stave off the threat of Anthropogenic Global Warming, and especially in the United States. The current President has taken the sound advice of someone not to respond to the carbon threat. The next President has made clear that he is convinced of the danger, and that that should be sufficient for action.
[Sound science applied to disassembling what the IPCC has perpetrated might bring scientists with influence to create more people like U.S. Senator James Inhofe. That is the hope behind this blog.
[A lot of money is going to be wasted on this effort, and nothing good or even positive will come of it. Even if the increase in CO2 could be reversed, it would have no effect on temperature.
[The IPCC considered the weak CO2 emitted by human cement product (about 3% of the total emissions), but ignored the respiration of humans, which is almost thrice as large and grows with the population. As man tries to survive in the Green Utopia without burning fossil fuels, he will walk more, and bicycle more, and exert more manual work, increasing his VCO2. (I wonder what Michael Phelps' VCO2 is.) Man will engage more horses and oxen for transportation and work, and add their VCO2 to the atmosphere. He will switch to biomass fuels. We need a computation to determine how much loss in efficiency is necessary to cause carbon emissions to increase.
[Salvation might lie from the likes of the countries you mentioned, China, India, and Russia. Their leaders lack the opportunities and wisdom of Western Bachelor of Arts degrees to pursue anything so improbable and contrary to their self-interest. The next President and legislature of the U.S. could be susceptible to the argument that we can't have any effect going it alone, or to the pettiness of "hey, they're not doing it!"
[Meanwhile, Earth will warm or cool from natural events, exactly as though neither man nor CO2 existed.
Posted by John, Channel Isles | August 26, 2008 7:46 AM
Dear Dr G,
A BBC report (Oct 2007) claimed a 10-year study in the North Atlantic showed CO2 ocean uptake had halved between the mid-90s and 2000 to 2005.
The scientists believe global warming "… might get worse if the oceans soak up less of the greenhouse gas... there were grounds for believing that, in time, the ocean might become saturated with our emissions - unable to soak up any more."
Further their report claims that would "leave all our emissions to warm the atmosphere. Of all the CO2 emitted into the atmosphere, only half of it stays there; the rest goes into the 2 main carbon sinks (biosphere and oceans).
The BBC report was quoting the Schuster and Watson study, I believe.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7053903.stm
Just as I cannot imagine our atmosphere reaching "saturation" points of CO2 when it s only a trace element (0.038%) I also cannot imagine the oceans reaching a saturation point anytime in the next 20 million years!!!
Que 1). What are the current ocean levels of CO2 and is there a saturation point?
[RSJ: According to the IPCC, the ocean holds 38,000 GtC, of which 37,000 GtC is in the form of Dissolved Inorganic Carbon (DIC). "Seawater can, through inorganic processes, absorb large amounts of CO2 from the atmosphere… ". AR4, ¶7.3.4.1, p. 528. The IPCC shows that over geological time, the atmosphere has held 20 times as much CO2 as it has at the present, and for a relative recent, continuous period of about 20 million years, it had a level of one third the present. Where did that CO2 go? The answer is, into the ocean buffer capacity. A more sophisticated question is, what was the CO2 concentration in the ocean when the atmospheric concentration was over six and a half million parts per million? The answer from Henry's Law is that it was about 20 times the concentration today.
[The IPCC doesn't quibble about some ultimate capacity to hold CO2. The ocean likely has sufficient capacity to absorb the CO2 produced by the entire stock of about 3500 GtC of fossil fuels (AR4, Figure 7.3, p. 515). Its AGW conjecture is that the ocean can't absorb it as fast as the rate of production ACO2. It says,
The marine carbonate buffer system allows the ocean to take up CO2[(g)] far in excess of its potential uptake capacity based on solubility alone, and in doing so controls the pH of the ocean. This control is achieved by a series of reactions that transform carbon added as CO2 into HCO3(-) [bicarbonate ion] and CO3(2-) [carbonate ion]. These three dissolved forms (collectively known as DIC) are found in the approximate ratio CO2[(aq)]:HCO3(-):CO3(2-) of 1:100:10 … . AR4, Box 7.3, p. 529.
[and
The availability of carbonate is particularly important because it controls the maximum amount of CO2 that the ocean is able to absorb. AR4, ¶5.4.2.4.
[The slow absorption is a model the IPCC invented so that the increase in the last 50 years measured at Mauna Loa would be caused by man, its preconceived notion necessary for the catastrophe and all the good news that that entails. Its model involves putting constraints on the exchange between the atmosphere and the ocean such that the ocean is perpetually in thermodynamic equilibrium. Like the drunk looking for his keys under the lamppost, chemical equations are solvable if equilibrium is assumed. In fact, it is never in that state, and the IPCC has no model for the carbon cycle in any state of disequilibrium.
[On the other hand, the process of solubility is known only for the state of equilibrium. The IPCC would revise Henry's Laws of solubility. But this dissolution is a kinetic process, and as the IPCC admitted in a draft report and then deleted, it happens "instantaneously". At least it's fast enough compared to the biochemical processes which approach equilibrium on time scales of centuries to perhaps a dozen millennia. Consequently, expect the uptake of CO2, the process called solubility, to push the ocean into disequilibrium in the mixed surface layer, which then acts as a buffer for the biochemical processes to proceed at their separate paces.
[In short, given the present state of the oceans, identified perhaps as having a developed thermohaline circulation (THC), no practical limit exists to the capacity or the rate of the ocean to absorb CO2.]
Que 2). Are the ship measurements accurate, if so what would account for the 50% decline in ocean CO2 absorption. If not accurate why, are they measuring fluxes in ocean currents mistakenly (i.e., the same 'patch' of ocean which may have annual fluxes in CO2 as warm currents enter the area)?
[RSJ: Until proven otherwise, let's assume the measurements are accurate, and cast no aspersions on the investigators and crew.
[Now take a look at the Takahashi diagram of the ocean atmosphere exchange at AR4, Figure 7.8, p. 523. The ocean is broken into 1759 cells of 13 flux bands. Eleven of those bands have a width of 0.5 moles per meter squared per year. A 50% variation in some of those cells should be chalked up to regional or weather variations.
[The story is quite different for the remaining two cells. One is eight times larger than the majority, and represents the uptake of CO2 at the coldest spots, in the RJS model forming the headwaters of the THC. The other is seven times as large, and represents the outgassing from the THC primarily in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific, plus a bit in the Western Indian Ocean and another bit off Aleutians. If these were to change by such a percentage, the composition of the atmosphere would be undergoing a radical change.
[After the THC outgassing, the surface ocean heads poleward, cooling and continuously absorbing increasing amounts of CO2. Absorption occurs at variable rates, depending on major and minor weather and ocean current phenomena. In the end, though, the concentration is one atmosphere's worth at the temperature of ice water. How the water got to that state, 50% more here, less there, makes no difference.]
I found the above in a RealClimate article (Nov 07) purporting there's more studies showing the oceans are "getting fed up absorbing all the extra CO2". So just the usual fatalistic green mind-set imposed on science and nature then!!
See posts 3, 13 and 39. Can I ask you to comment on the article and the posts mentioned please.
RealClimate Link. http://tinyurl.com/5va727
[RSJ: The sum knowledge of a committee is proportional to the number of members. The IQ of a committee, however, adds like resistors in parallel: the total IQ is the reciprocal of the sum of the reciprocals of the IQ of each member. The IQ of a library is zero. So it is with Legislatures, the Consensus on Climate, and RealClimate.org. This is why science advances by individuals, and not by committees, and why the peer reviewed literature is in such a sorry state.
[The article you referenced and the article it referenced are both by "David", who is likely Professor David Archer, a highly respected expert in computational ocean chemistry at the University of Chicago, often cited in the IPCC Reports and himself a contributing author to both the IPCC and RealClimate.org. He has posted several quite helpful papers online. His knowledge of the ocean is extensive, and trivializes the storehouse of RSJ's ocean information. Nevertheless, his ultimate concept of the carbon cycle, safe to say, is incorrect.
[Archer is likely the source of the following submodels. (1) The ocean absorbs CO2 according to multiple processes with differing time constants which either switch on and off, or follow a process that channels the flow of CO2 into the different processes. (2) The Revelle buffer factor is the ratio of the rate of change of CO2(aq) to the rate of change of DIC. (3) Chemical equilibrium in the ocean constrains solubility. None of these is valid.
[David says,
If changing climate were to cause the natural world to slow down its carbon uptake, or even begin to release carbon, that would exacerbate the climate forcing from fossil fuels: a positive feedback.
[In the following, assume the atmosphere is a by-product of the ocean, and that the biosphere effects while large are compensating, so that in the net they are negligible.
[Changing climate will not affect carbon uptake, at least until the THC as we know it ends, the ocean is substantially ice covered, or the ice caps are gone. The release of carbon is perpetually underway, and it is sensitive to the global average surface temperature (GAST). Notwithstanding that fossil fuels have a positive effect on the sum of the greenhouse gases, and notwithstanding that greenhouse gases have a positive effect on the GAST, the effects are trivial and compounding, mitigated twice by water vapor, once as a GHG but first as Earth's albedo. A feedback exists, but it is trivial and unmeasurable.
[Because the feedback is minute, the amplification of the ice age recoveries is not amplified as David and the IPCC claim. This is a conjecture AGW believers invented to correct for premature conclusions about CO2 and climate from the paleo record, too good not to be true until the discovery that CO2 lags temperature, not the reverse.
[The stratification David discusses would be irrelevant, if it existed. David's model, like the GCMs and that of Revelle and Suess (1957) is mostly vertical, but the ocean has an even more powerful and dominating lateral component. The surface ocean perpetually cools from the outgassing to the uptake in the THC, taking in more and more CO2. Good of David to mention Henry's Law, though! The IPCC did not rely on it in either of its two most recent reports. But at that, David discussed the pCO2 differences, admittedly negligible, but ignored the temperature dependence of Henry's coefficient.
[In his referent paper, David decides we shouldn't "push the big red Stop the Press button down at IPCC". What needs pressing is the Big Red Stop button for the whole of the IPCC.
[Re Comment #3 to David's article, kudos to David for criticizing the terrestrial models that are "all done by difference." The entire IPCC AGW model suffers from two aspects of this general science problem. One is that it deals with the small differences between huge numbers, a classic faux pas of the tyro. The large numbers are the natural processes, and the small differences, the IPCC attributes to man. This presumes that the models are additive, equivalently that they are linear, and this is the backbone of the whole of the radiative forcing paradigm on which the IPCC relies. Simple models, like Henry's Law, have nonlinear aspects, e.g., absorption is proportional to pCO2(g) but outgassing is inversely proportional to it. The problem with the small difference in large numbers is that the variance of the difference is the sum of the variance of both the large numbers. An alarm should ring in reading IPCC Reports every time the word "net" appears, explicitly or implicitly. This includes every radiative forcing number, and every reference to a few Gigatons of uptake.
[The biosphere is negligible because the net uptake and outgassing to the atmosphere is quite small, and because the isotopic ratio is the same in each direction. The fluxes are large, especially considering the volume of leaf water, which the IPCC introduces then ignores. But consider a three box model for the climate, land, sea, and air. Because the input and output to the land are nearly the same (within the accuracy of any kind of modeling), the input can be shorted to the output for the land and for the air on the land side, and the model won't know the difference.
[As a bonus, take a look at David's response to Comment #9. His answer here assumes chemical equilibrium in the surface layer, and that that constrains solubility. Neither is true.
[Re Comment #13, like David, no comment. What caught your interest here?
[Re Comment #39, again there is no response from David. The writer speaks of the problem with the kinetics of biological reactions (685 GtC DOC), but these are trivial compared to the problems on the inorganic side (37,000 GtC DIC). The size of the components shows the relative importance on one scale, but the problem on the inorganic side is what the writer calls "pure equilibrium chemistry". In the real ocean, equilibrium essentially exists with respect to solubility because of its soda-pop-quick reaction time, once called instantaneous by the IPCC.
[The reactions that form the ratio of [CO2(aq):[HCO3(-)]:[CO3(2-)], the components of DIC, are only known in equilibrium and at specific total concentration, pressure, temperature, and salinity. (Research the Bjerrum diagram or graph and its origins.) The same thing holds for the Revelle Factor, as revised by the IPCC. Thermodynamic equilibrium, as applied with the Gibbs' free energy potential, which defines the state of chemical equilibrium, is such a weak force that it is unlikely to ever reach its final state in the open ocean. The Bjerrum relationships and the Revelle Factor do not constrain solubility. The pH of the ocean is not determined by the rates of chemical reactions and hence the concentrations of the three components except at a hypothetical equilibrium.
[Each parcel of surface water is perpetually cooling, among other things, and absorbing more CO2 during its lifetime. In a vertical model based on a network of cells, the surface is constant, but this is like a standing wave, a phase phenomenon in particle motion. The model might treat the properties as a constant, but the lateral currents perpetually replenish the parcel. The surface segment might have any component ratio, quite unlike that at equilibrium. The values might be constant, at least under suitable assumptions, or in steady state, but never in equilibrium.
[Lack of appreciation of the phase structure of cell parameters has led some investigators and the IPCC often to treat the ocean and the atmosphere above as stagnant. This problem is compounded by processes too complex, or of the wrong scale for the model, to be parameterized (parametrized, Br.), meaning in IPCC parlance that the process dynamics get replaced with a constant value that looks about right statistically. This destroys feedback, a phenomenon about which the IPCC obsesses, but with little understanding and invalid modeling.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | August 31, 2008 10:09 PM
Dear Dr Glassman,
Many thanks for your response to my comments of 24 August. Here are a few observations on Engelbeen's sources, on the off chance that any of them are new to you.
[RSJ: See link posted by David on 8/24/08 and comments by RSJ.]
The IPCC sees AR4 fig. 7.8 (Takahashi) as evidence that the oceans are net sinks rather than sources of CO2. In the caption to that figure, it gives figures for the uptake and outgassing of anthropogenic CO2 (which apparently doesn't like to mix with natural CO2!) that are the same as those given in its fig. 7.3, but this time it fails to mention the error margins of +/-20%. Fig. 7.8 is similar to the following chart for 1995 sea-air flux:
http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/pubs/outstand/feel2331/images/fig06.jpg.
This appears in a freely available article cited by Engelbeen: Feely, R.A., et al. (2001), Uptake and storage of carbon dioxide in the ocean: the global CO2 survey, Oceanography, 14(4), 18-32,
http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/pubs/outstand/feel2331/feel2331.shtml.
Engelbeen says that surveys over time have shown that parts of the ocean that were net sources of CO2 gradually changed into net absorbers, citing a 2007 presentation by Metzl:
http://ioc3.unesco.org/ioccp/pCO2_workshop/Presentations/metzl-SOCOVV-Final2.pps.
[RSJ: The Metzl slide show (pps) is about the Southern and Indian Oceans, so is a regional analysis with no obvious or, perhaps, relevant connection to the GLOBAL warming conjecture. It includes maps showing the crisscrossing tracks of the cruises to gather data. Using the Takahashi diagram on which the IPCC relied, these treks are much less interesting than would have been an exploration of the regions of intense outgassing and the polar regions where the cold, CO2 saturated water descends to depth.
[However, Metzl shows a more recent Takahashi diagram, dated 2007, which has a remarkable, qualitatively different scaling. The colors on the map are discrete (as they must be). but the color range of the key is continuous and of poor resolution. The scale for 2007 is uniform, but nonlinear for 2002. The 2007 chart may also differ in that it represents a particular date and time (GMT 1/19/07 16:23:06), whereas the IPCC's version is an average of data collected from 1956, normalized to 1995, covering about 41 years, and published in 2002, and therefore preferable. The cell sizes appear to be about the same, but the 2007 version seems to lack the intensity of outgassing and polar uptake, especially in the targeted southern hemisphere. If the ocean flux follows a uniform gradient from uptake to outgassing, more like the 2007 version, then data sampling might as well be uniform across the seas. If the ocean behaves more like the 2002 version, than sampling should emphasize the high intensity regions.]
In support of his arguments regarding carbon isotope ratios, he cites, among other things: Battle, M., et al. (2000), Global carbon sinks and their variability inferred from atmospheric O2 and d13C. Science, v. 287, Böhm, F., et al. (2002), Evidence for preindustrial variations in the marine surface water carbonate system from coralline sponges, Geochem. Geophys. Geosyst., 3(3), 1019.
[RSJ: Here David provided two pay-per-view links, one a substitute for Engelbeen's pay-per-view link to his Reference 12 (Battle et al.) and the other identical his pay-per-view link for Reference 15 (Böhm et al.). This is not good scientific practice, but it is the technique employed by the IPCC to a fine art. A scientific article should be self-sufficient, fully quoting the relevant material from sources, whether copyrighted or not, which the law in the U.S. allows. References must be supplied, but only to verify that the article quoted the source correctly, and not to send the reader off on a data search.
[Many of the articles referenced by the IPCC do not support the claims made for them, but instead are merely professional stroking. The cost to an individual to debug the IPCC Reports would run into the tens of thousands of dollars, and much of the cost would be a pure waste. The United States should enforce the Freedom of Information Act on the IPCC, requiring every citation be made available in searchable format via the internet. That should be done before the first thing is done in reaction to its AGW alarm.
[The chronic reminder here is that there would be no climate crisis but for the IPCC. Alternative claims, whether supporting or not, are irrelevant. This turns out not to be a big problem at all. The IPCC Reports cannot stand scientific scrutiny just under their own weight.]
The graph Engelbeen uses to determine a correlation (R^2) of 0.997 between human CO2 emissions and the atmospheric CO2 increase is shown on his website (section 5.2) but he doesn't give any details of the calculation.
Regards,
David
[RSJ: Any such extraordinary correlation as 0.997 in the climate realm should be viewed with great skepticism. Engelbeen says in the opening line of his paper, CO2 Measurements, "In climate skeptics circles, …". Skepticism is a virtue in science, though certainly not every scientist exhibits it. However, where skepticism doesn't exist, as in the IPCC, science has left the building. In this instance, Engelbeen's conclusions are incorrect. He says in his ¶5.1,
This proves beyond doubt that human emissions are the main cause of the increase of CO2, at least over the past near 50 years. But there is even more proof of that...
[Engelbeen's ¶5.1 is called "The mass balance". Here he states,
The amount of CO2 emitted by humans nowadays is about 7 GtC/yr (CO2 counted as carbon). The increase in the atmosphere is about 4 GtC/yr. That implies that there is little to no increase in the atmosphere due to other causes, or the amount in the atmosphere in the case of a natural unbalance should be higher than the emissions, not lower.
[The datum implies nothing of the sort. He infers it.
[Moreover this is bears little resemblance to a mass balance analysis, especially because it ignores the natural flux, coupled with the fact that the ocean uptake and outgassing are known by Henry's Law, which, despite its linear appearance, happens to be nonlinear. This means that unless one discounts solubility, the natural and anthropogenic fluxes are not additive. How the mass balance must be done is the subject of the next paper to be posted on the RSJ.
[Furthermore, in the isotopic analysis by Engelbeen and the IPCC, the calculation of the mixing ratio of natural CO2 and ACO2 is missing. Another mass balance computation is needed to show whether the lightening of the mixture is correct for the addition of the two components.
[Engelbeen refers to the "very accurate measurements of CO2 at Mauna Loa." RSJ would have preferred him to say "precise measurements". The MLO measurements show precision in the repeatability of the seasonal cycle and in the low variance relative to the first and second order trend lines. However, accuracy requires that the MLO measurements be close to whatever it is that they are supposed to represent, the background CO2 level in Hawaii or the global average CO2 concentration. The IPCC shows that the MLO and South Pole measurements overlie one another with great precision. TAR, Figure 3.2a, p. 201. This accuracy may be the result of "internetwork calibration". However, as stated here repeatedly, SPO sits in a sink of CO2 uptake, and MLO in the plume of the Eastern Equatorial Pacific outgassing, and Keeling warned of the danger in comparing such records. The record at MLO is likely the precise and accurate, wind modulated, secularly varying CO2 concentration of the outgassing plume.
[Finally, Engelbeen and the IPCC imply that the 100% of natural CO2 is absorbed by the ocean annually, but only about 50% of ACO2 is absorbed. Neither gives any physical reason, but just leaves Henry's Law violated with no justification. My opinion is that any variation in solubility due to isotopic weight differences would not be measurable, lost in the noise of CO2 flux estimation. Mass balance and the analysis should respect the laws of solubility.]
Posted by David Pratt | September 6, 2008 12:52 PM
Hi Dr G,
Since learning about CO2's (limited) radiative forcing I've received this comment on a blog which I'm not able to answer: "The major infrared absorption bands of CO2 are indeed saturated at sea level, but, and this is a big but, as you go higher in the atmosphere the pressure and density fall. This means that you eventually reach an altitude where the bands are no longer saturated. This altitude increases as the concentration of CO2 rises. Consequently as man adds to this concentration the insulating blanket of the atmosphere effectively thickens and the earth's temperature rises."
[RSJ: The problem you pose is not well-stated. Like a mixed metaphor, it combines two quite different modeling concepts, radiative forcing and infrared absorption. Radiative forcing is the IPCC's elected paradigm with which to model climate. It contains an underlying assumption of equilibrium for natural processes, to which it assumes increments due to man might be added (the problematic linear assumption) as if they were radiation equivalents. Infrared absorption relates to the passage of energy through a medium from a hot surface to a cold surface. The latter is thermodynamic modeling; radiative forcing is not. Thermodynamic modeling involves the passage of energy and material between elements at different temperatures, each with its own heat capacity, and a characteristic resistance of the medium impedes the flow, whether by radiation, convection, or conduction. The thermodynamic model may be linear or nonlinear, according to whatever works.
[In contrast with thermodynamic modeling, radiative forcing has no flow variable, and does not model the temperature or heat capacity of all the elements. Radiative forcing has no obvious way to assess the closed loop gain of a particular feedback.
[Reading between the lines of the IPCC's Third Assessment Report, one sees that radiative forcing has met with only limited success, and despite strong criticism from unnamed sources, required the staunchest defense. See especially TAR, Ch. 6, Radiative Forcing of Climate Change, Executive Summary, p. 351, and ¶6.1 Radiative Forcing, ¶6.1.1 Definition, p. 353. The IPCC has even had trouble defining radiative forcing.
[The Executive Summary paragraph says,
Radiative forcing continues to be a useful tool to estimate, to a first order, the relative climate impacts (viz., relative global mean surface temperature responses) due to radiatively induced perturbations. The practical appeal of the radiative forcing concept is due, in the main, to the assumption that there exists a general relationship between the global mean forcing and the global mean equilibrium surface temperature response (i.e., the global mean climate sensitivity parameter, λ) which is similar for all the different types of forcings. Model investigations of responses to many of the relevant forcings indicate an approximate near invariance of λ (to about 25%). There is some evidence from model studies, however, that λ can be substantially different for certain forcing types. TAR, Ch. 6 Radiative Forcing of Climate Change, Executive Summary, p. 351.
[Here are the first confessions of trouble with the radiative forcing paradigm -- "continues to be a useful tool" despite its failures; "to a first order", meaning don't ask for nuances, like transient, coupled, or nonlinear responses. But what follows next is the IPCC's dawn of discovery of thermodynamic modeling. The climate sensitivity parameter is first of all significant because of its near constancy. Secondly, as shown from its definition at equation 6.1, (TAR ¶6.2, p. 354), it has the units of TºC per watt per square meter. It is the parameter characteristic of a blanket, and the atmosphere is a blanket. It is a thermodynamic resistance, being careful of the sign, and provides in this instance the heat drop across the atmosphere as energy flows from the surface of Earth to the heat sink of deep space.
[What this all means is that if λ is approximately a constant it characterizes the greenhouse effect, and one need not bother with the fine structure of the atmosphere. Using λ, we don't care about where the resistance occurs, whether in the bottom, middle, or top of the troposphere, the stratosphere, or anywhere else. We only care about the end-to-end effect, and we don't care because λ is nearly invariant.
[This is analogous to the problem of ocean absorption of CO2. We don't care how it is absorbed along the currents from equator to the poles because at the end, the absorption is close enough in equilibrium with ice water. Fine structure of the climate, whether horizontal or vertical, is instructive for learning about the climate and predicting weather, but it tends to be a distraction in the ultimate, macroparameter problem of the thermodynamics of Earth and GAST, the global average surface temperature.
[So if one wants to model the temperature profile of the atmosphere, such matters as the height of the troposphere, or points where the radiation absorption shifts from water vapor to CO2, are important. But taken as a whole for the purpose of assessing GAST, its rather irrelevant.
[From another viewpoint, energy in the absorption bands of CO2 is sharply attenuated in the atmospheric surface layer, mostly from water vapor, plus a little from CO2. What gets past the surface layer in the CO2 band will be subjected to absorption by just CO2 in the stratosphere, but the surface warming effect from that level is nil.
[The part of the argument dealing with the altitude relies on the parameter of the rate of absorption per unit distance, or thickness. This is a refinement of the problem, and another bit of a distraction. If your absorption data are in the form of attenuation per meter, you need to be mindful of the layer thickness. This might be the case if your data are the power spectral density of the absorption.
[On the other hand, if your data represent the attenuation of, say, a set of layers, then the thickness has already been taken into account. When we talk about the absorption band of CO2 being "saturated at sea level", the data graph we contemplate probably is indistinguishable from 100% at the peaks of the curve, and we are referring to the total absorption through the surface layer, or more. The thickness of the surface layer is no longer a parameter, so long as the data are valid, and the thickness of the layers above doesn't matter in the band of concern where the absorption was already nearly complete.]
I presume this is referring some how to the 'hot spots' theory the IPCC claims their computer models reveal in the upper atmosphere. I've read a Science & Public Policy Institute article (link below) that shows the claimed hot spots do not appear in the observed data.
[RSJ: If you don't mind, I'll skip the external reference. The IPCC tries to model the ocean and atmosphere as multiple, vertical layers, perhaps giving each some characteristic radiative forcing. We really don't want to debug the finer workings of that radiative forcing model, considering its gross errors and inconsistencies.]
The SPPI article states "In the plot from the Hadley Centre's radiosondes, showing actual, observed temperatures in the troposphere as predicted by 5 IPCC computer models, the repeatedly-predicted "hot-spot" signature of anthropogenic greenhouse warming is entirely absent. Indeed, very nearly all observational data on mid-tropospheric temperature trends over the past half-century show no tropical "hot-spot" at all."
[RSJ: So Hadley confirms that one little aspect of the IPCC's radiative forcing model doesn't work. It's a straw in the backpack, but the camel's already down.]
I also cannot see how CO2 can 'change' its forcing just through altitude! Can you advise please?
[RSJ: CO2 has a certain, characteristic absorption band, as given by charts compiled from experiment, grossly approximated by analytical modeling, and valid in some, usually unstated temperature and pressure band, and in units such as per meter or per meter per wave number. For the characteristic band to be valid, the CO2 has to be gas, and neither a liquid nor a plasma, and perhaps has to be under some light pressure, making it somewhere close to an ideal gas. If the temperature and pressure don't seem to fit these assumptions, set up an experiment to measure the band under the appropriate conditions.
[The CO2 isn't changing, but, in a couple of different ways, the model of its effects is. My advice is don't bother with radiative forcing except to debunk the IPCC. For a reality check, keep in mind a separate thermodynamic concept for climate processes - nodal temperatures with heat capacitance including heat sinks, heat flow (redundant, I know) through resistances.]
Link. http://tinyurl.com/23u6ae
Thank you again for your help.
Posted by John, Channel Isles | September 7, 2008 11:24 PM
Sorry, the blogger made this comment too: "Additionally the higher layers of the atmosphere are colder and so radiate less heat into space."
I think this blogger is trying to attach two unrelated issues in order to make a point that's not there (i.e. be a smart-arse)!!
[RSJ: The concept of a layer that absorbs, hence warms, and then itself radiates is common in the IPCC and its sources. I'd like to see more of this idea developed somewhere. It is common for a microwave reflector, which is the model of a mirror, and indeed a necessary model where the Doppler effect applies. But in the microwave model, the reflector absorbs 100% of the radiation, and reradiates much of it. For a layer of stratosphere, however, we would need to know its absorptivity, its reflectivity, and its transmissivity, and model the fate of all three processes. This seems like a horribly complex way to model the atmosphere, cut into arbitrary layers interconnected to every other layer through transmissivity or reflectivity. Unless we want to model inversion layers, for example, the whole problem can be avoided for assessing the global average surface temperature by using λ and the notion of thermal blankets.
[In spite of the vast knowledge contributed by the Ray Pierrehumberts, Nicolas Grubers, and David Archers, the IPCC, the Consensus on Climate, and all supporting peer reviewed technical journals, can't model feedback coherently, nor equilibrium, and, once we see the IPCC's layer re-radiation model, I'll bet you can add that, too. The IPCC breaks down not just in thermodynamics and system modeling, but at the transcendent levels of the ethics and principles of science.
[The committee trumps every member. IQ adds like resistors in parallel. The committee is dumber than the dumbest member. And less principled than the least.
[Was your blogger friend on the committee?]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | September 7, 2008 11:35 PM
No my blogger 'friend' was just another hysterical comrade of the socialist agenda behind this climate fraud (I call it fraud now because it involves winkling huge sums of money off taxpayers).
The IPCC committee, or Report authors, are indeed "less principled than the least" and having seen one debate on ABC Australia (a biased attempt to debunk the 'Great … Swindle' film) they appear to be very smart with language, as I've seen from IPCC reports, to bamboozle people with word-play into submission.
[RSJ: John refers to the Great Climate Warming Swindle, an excellent and highly commendable UK documentary debunking the AGW conjecture. It can be seen with French subtitles at
http://video.google.fr/videoplay?docid=-4123082535546754758
[It does have flaws, and could be strengthened in several ways, but the message would not change. To see some of the anti-anti-AGW arguments, visit Wikipedia at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Global_Warming_Swindle
[I recommend visiting the Wikipedia site first, then watch the movie, even watch it again if you've seen it once. Professor Carl Wunsch appears several times in the documentary, and now regrets it. The documentary had no opportunity to misquote him, and whether his quotes might have been out of place is highly subjective and not at all obvious in the viewing.
[Eigil Friis-Christensen took issue with a graph depicting his research, and the producers admitted to an error in that graph. He understates his case with such obtuse phrases as "We have concerns" and "we have reason to believe". He admits the narration in the film "is consistent with the conclusions of [his] paper", but complains that it incorrectly omitted a contribution by ACO2.
[In fact an error did exist in the presentation of his data, but not the omission of which Friis-Christensen complained. The discovered error is not clearly explained in Wikipedia, but it seems that a gap or gaps in data from 1610 to 1710 were bridged with a line or lines.
[This graphical technique is precisely what the IPCC does in connecting the sparse data points in ice core data, as shown in the documentary and the IPCC Reports. This is scientifically acceptable, although some representations are less ambiguous than others. However, the IPCC concludes from its follow-the-dots technique that the temperatures in this and the last century are unprecedented over the last hundreds of thousands of years. Considering the scarcity of ice core data, the confidence level in the IPCC assertion is no more than 3%, a fact it ignores, even though the IPCC goes to great lengths to make its subjective opinions appear objective simply by assigning arbitrary probabilities.
[Wikipedia quotes Friis-Christensen as saying,
I think several points were not explained in the way that I, as a scientist, would have explained them ... it is obvious it's not accurate.
[So it always must be in communicating science to the layman.
[Another graph had a mislabeled time axis, which the producers corrected for subsequent showings. Also the effects of volcanoes may have been overstated, and certainly the IPCC would not agree.
[The Great Global Warming Swindle shows the tragic effect environmentalists would have in Africa by diverting development of conventional electricity generation to exotic alternatives. This would not be the first time environmentalism produced a human catastrophe greater than the total effects of socialism in all its guises. DDT had reduced the number of deaths from malaria from perhaps tens of millions world wide to a few tens of thousands per year. The selective banning of DDT manufacture and its use in agriculture, all in the name of environmental theory, appears to have substantially reversed those gains, and the mortality rate is climbing back to 10,000 a day. Rachel Carlson shares something in common with Hitler and Stalin.
[The GGWS does a good job of putting the AGW conjecture into perspective with global climate as it has been known. There have been a couple of extended and prosperous eras far warmer than the present. From a higher perspective, the documentary might have featured how stable Earth's climate is. Climatology should have sought the explanation for that stability, and estimated its margins. Instead, they have conjectured that Earth is unstable, at one of James E. Hansen's "tipping points", ready for catastrophe. Long ago, Hansen predicted we were 10 years away from his tipping point. He still says so today. We're at t minus 10 years and holding, and have been for more than two decades according to him.
[Two fundamental precepts of science are violated by this tipping point nonsense. One is that science routinely finds unstable objects in the universe, like supernovas everywhere. Cones are not found standing on their points, nor round boulders perched on the sides of hills. Earth is in a quasi-stable state, and not ready to explode. The other is the prerequisite that a model make predictions that become validated before they are ever used for pubic policy. The GCMs make no such predictions, and so can never be validated. Hansen's little prediction might have been such a qualifying prediction, except that it simply failed.
[The GGWS documentary might have noted that the IPCC specifically ejected the galactic cosmic ray model for cloud formation for lack of evidence. The data show however that CGR intensity is more strongly correlated with global climate than is El Niño. See Solar Wind, El Niño/Southern Oscillation, & Global Temperature: Events & Correlations in the RSJ.
[The Swindle would be stronger if reinforced with the specific, flagrant errors in the IPCC Reports and its GCMs. The two major examples are that the GCMs simulate neither the carbon cycle nor the hydrological cycle correctly. They omit the positive feedback of ocean outgassing, and the negative feedback of temperature to water vapor to cloud cover. The first frustrates the IPCC's conjecture about CO2 accumulation in the atmosphere, and the second accounts for Earth's climate stability, trumping the greenhouse effect.]
What troubles is the 'Tax & Control' socialist agenda has moved from cars to aeroplanes and accelerated onto household products and even food in very short time. The IPCC's Dr. Pachauri is due at a global food conference aiming for a 60% reduction in meat consumption by 2030. The US EPA have already set rules for lawnmowers and outboard motors. The EEC have got all car makers jumping through CO2 hoops to align manufacturers with the Communist ideal all car makers are (should be) equal - even luxury brands Mercedes and BMW - or you'll be fined.
None of which will have the slightest impact on man's CO2 especially with so many major countries like China and Russia sticking 2 fingers up to Kyoto.
If the UN are looking for 'behaviour change' then I've certainly got the message. I'm following the US elections and rooting for the Republicans for the first time in my life as the lesser of two climate evils. If America votes Obama in it's the end of capitalism in Europe as the EEC will have a major partner in the socialist enviro-agenda across the Atlantic.
[RSJ: John is talking about Rajendra Kumar Pachauri, chairman of the IPCC, and as such, co-recipient of the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize awarded to the IPCC and Albert Arnold Gore, Jr. "for their efforts to build up and disseminate greater knowledge about man-made climate change, and to lay the foundations for the measures that are needed to counteract such change."
[Pachauri has dual PhDs, one in Industrial Engineering and another in Economics from North Carolina State University.
[Yet Pachauri advocates cutting back on the world consumption of meat. For the sake of fanning the flames of his global warming conjecture, he would begin to reduce meat consumption and increase the incidence of iron deficiency anemia, which is already a global human health problem. No practical substitute exists for the intake of the heme molecule through the ingestion of red meat. IDA increases mortality in child birth, in the elderly, in heart disease, in grafts and organ transplant, in all surgery, in COPD, probably in the chronically ill, and undoubtedly in starvation.
[As it was with DDT, the human toll is irrelevant in the political calculus of environmentalism.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | September 8, 2008 11:09 PM
Hi Dr G,
Roger Pielke Sr. has recently (July'08) criticised the IPCC again for omitting peer-reviewed literature, including 3 studies relating to temperature;
Matsui & Pielke, 2006, on "the aerosol effect on atmospheric circulations alteration in the heating of regions of the atmosphere is 60 times greater than due to the heating effect of the human addition of well-mixed greenhouse gases";
[RSJ: This first paper says, with bold added,
A major conclusion is that, as a climate metric to diagnose climate system heat changes (i.e., ''global warming''), the surface temperature trend, especially if it includes the trend in nighttime temperature, is not the most suitable climate metric. As reported by Pielke [2003], the assessment of climate heat system changes should be performed using the more robust metric of ocean heat content changes rather than surface temperature trends.]
A study based on Lin et al 2007, showing "warm bias in the construction of a global average surface temperature trend … explains about 30% of the IPCC estimate of global warming. In other words, consideration of the bias in temperature would reduce the IPCC trend to about 0.14°C per decade;"
[RSJ: The second article says, with bold added,
We also introduced a new temperature assessment metric - the near surface lapse rate. …
Our exploration of near surface lapse rate changes including wind effects should, therefore, be extended to longer-term time series as well as cover larger spatial areas.]
And Pielke et al 2007 "the outgoing long wave radiation is proportional to the fourth power of T [T4], from Stefan-Boltzman's Law" and "spatial distribution matters, but the important distinction has been ignored" by the IPCC who should "evaluate the change of the global average of T4 with time."
[RSJ: The summary of the third paper says, bold added,
We present a measurement-based estimation of the spatial gradient of aerosol radiative forcing. The NGoRF [Normalized Gradient of Radiative Forcing] is introduced to represent the potential effect of the heterogeneous radiative forcing on the general circulation and regional climate.]
Pielke concludes "unless the climate science community returns to the proper scientific method of examining the climate system, policymakers will continue to be fed erroneous information. Only poor policy decisions can result due to this failure."
Link. http://tinyurl.com/6noneo
Are the IPCC getting better or worse regards methodology and best practice for assimilating and scripting reports with time with all the peer reviewed advise (criticism) they're receiving from the outside (skeptical) scientific community?
[RSJ: All three papers are by Roger Pielke Sr. as first or second author, and published in Geophysical Research Letters.
[Each of the three papers urges changing the parameters of the problem, including even the statement of the AGW problem. Each might lead to a more accurate scientific model, one actually with predictive power and one which fits the historical record. But the IPCC has firmly established to the nonscientific world that climate is measured by the macroparameter of the global average surface temperature, GAST. Beyond that, it is dedicated, at all costs, to proving that manmade CO2 emissions cause a catastrophic increase in GAST. It is not dedicated to scientific objectivity or better models. Pielke is barking up the wrong tree.
[Nor is the IPCC in any way a clearing house for scientific papers on climate. And even if it were a legitimate scientific agency, a mantle it does not deserve, it would be under no obligation to do so. The principles of science allow a scientist to build a model using selective bits of submodels, and even to build it upon selected pieces of data. However, if his model fails to fit all the data in its domain, as is the case with GCMs, it is invalid. Next, if his model makes a nontrivial prediction validated by subsequent measurements, it is eligible to be advanced to a theory (and only then used for public policy).
[Whatever a theory might omit is far from being to the discredit of the model. The more that a model can omit, the more is shown extraneous, the more elegant is the model, and the more preferred. Occam's Razor is to shave away the unnecessary. Of two models which fit the data identically and make the identical, validated prediction, the one with the least assumptions or fewest parts survives.
[Pielke should look to the end result of the IPCC modeling and identify where and why it fails. Then he would be in a position to set the modeling on the right track using alternative measurements and criteria.
[The IPCC produces a couple of reports a decade. It does not conduct a dialog with scientists and the public. It responds to criticism only as it might choose, and then in its reports. When it does respond, its technique is dismissive. This is the IPCC's methodology. It is bamboozle (I think I made a noun). It is consistent, but otherwise beyond the pale of science.
[Surrogates for the IPCC do speak for it in public, and they have contributed some good scientific dialog where the IPCC is silent. RealClimate.org is a good example, and a good resource for the wary. Still, RealClimate.org picks and chooses (forgive the idiom) its battles, and quickly resorts to slander and ad hominem attacks.
[Listen to the testimony of the scientists in The Great Global Warming Swindle.]
Posted by John, Channel Isles | September 9, 2008 12:49 PM
This website is a "fantastic" (meaning no. 7) source of information and good attitudes. I seem to share very similar values as you, but I'm not a trained scientist, I've only been aware of the science fraud for six months; for the six months before that I was a totally committed catastrophic AGW supporter, on the strength of Al Gore, all the local concern groups, and all the checking of the science that I was able to discover from Gristmill's Coby Beck, New Scientist, etc.
[RSJ: Just so all the readers are aware, fantastic meaning no. 7 is "extraordinarily good". American Heritage Dictionary, online edition.]
With such a U-turn, and needing to deconstruct so much, I coped by writing it down into what became a Skeptics' Climate Science Primer at
http://www.greenworldtrust.org.uk/Science/Curious.htm.
[RSJ: This is a blog called Reclaiming Science with the subtitle, Skeptical Climate Science Primer. A few minutes browsing through this work shows it could prove to be a most useful resource for the subject. RSJ would remind readers that skepticism is a virtue in science.
Having had a lot of warm comments about it from the skeptics' community, I know I can recommend it - it also references other primers as well as a lot of sources that seemed good. I wouldn't mind if you like to look over it - it's always open to improvement. Early on I realized you had some vital science - but I found reading the long screeds that your pages have become, pretty intolerable. There was so much material to cover.
[RSJ:A screed is a long discourse or essay, but it has the pejorative meaning of a diatribe or scraps of writing.]
I feel that DISTILLING the research into the real science we need, is really important. It seems we simply cannot use the old formats. Peer-reviewing has corrupted, the traditional journals ban you, there are no textbooks as yet, scientists are reeling and confused, or simply shrug, or get together on Watts Up to laugh, or are still unaware of the "Hamlet's Uncle" business, or have been bought into silence and compliance. University courses would take too long and be too expensive and unhelpful with the work that actually is needed - Reclaiming Science - starting with something like Climate Science that has been particularly vulnerable to corruption. I'm reaching for this as my next project - but it's still "under construction" and my ideas are not clear or complete as yet.
[RSJ: Agreed.]
Now for the detail questions - these will get built into the primer:-
Do you know the figures for the solubility of CO2 in fresh water and seawater?
[RSJ: A graph of the solubility of CO2 in water is Figure 6 of The Acquittal of CO2, above. According to venerable Henry's Law, solubility depends on the partial pressure of CO2 above the water, and the temperature of the water. These remain the dominant variables, but climate research has led to an empirical equation for solubility which includes a minor dependency on salinity, attributed to Weiss, R.F., Carbon dioxide in water and seawater: the solubility of a non-ideal gas. Mar. Chem., 2, (1974) 203-215. That work does not seem to be available online. However, a graph and the complete equation can be seen on slide 11 of Wolf-Gladrow, CO2 in Seawater: Equilibrium, Kinetics, Isotopes, based on a 2001 book with the same title by Zeebe and Wolf-Gladrow. The slides are available on line at
http://www.carboocean.org/Education_hp/Bergen/CO2inSeawater-06f.pdf.
[Note 10/4/08: Lucy Skywalker reports difficulty opening the above link. Firefox returns "Not Found" by clicking on the link, however copying and pasting the link in the Firefox URL line works. In Safari, the link works both ways. In the alternative, the following works and may be more robust. Open the following index:
http://www.carboocean.org/Education_hp/Bergen/
[and click on the second link titled CO2inSeawater-06f.pdf. End Note 10/4/08.
[The CDIAC is always an excellent source for information on CO2, and it has a handbook online called the Guide to Best Practices for Ocean CO2 Measurements, Pices Special Publication 3, IOCCP Report No. 8. It has a slightly different and somewhat superior version of Weiss's equation for Henry's Constant in Chapter 5, p. 12 of 19, equation (30).]
The data for your calculations that the Sun gives the Earth 24,000 times as much heat as all humankind?
[RSJ: That reference in passing was to a calculation from the '70s. Since then, man's primary energy use has more than doubled, so a better figure today would be about 12,000. It's a comparison, for what it's worth, between the total solar radiation intercepted by Earth's disc, 1367.6 w/m 2 , which is equivalent to 5.22 x 10 6 Quads/per year compared now to the 2005 Primary Energy of 462.8 Quads published by the Energy Information Administration.]
What exactly is "leaf water" and what is the source for your figures?
[RSJ: The IPCC introduces leaf water into the climate problem as follows:
Higher plants acquire CO2 by diffusion through tiny pores (stomata) into leaves and thus to the sites of photosynthesis. The total amount of CO2 that dissolves in leaf water amounts to about 270 PgC/yr, i.e., more than one-third of all the CO2 in the atmosphere. This quantity is measurable because this CO2 has time to exchange oxygen atoms with the leaf water and is imprinted with the corresponding 18O "signature". Most of this CO2 diffuses out again without participating in photosynthesis. Citations omitted, TAR, §3.2.2.1
[Thereafter, the IPCC gives leaf water little notice. It is absent from the IPCC's carbon cycle budget, but has a major influence on the residence time of carbon in the atmosphere if it is in included in the IPCC's residence time equation. The latter is found in the IPCC's glossaries, but it, too, is not mentioned in the text of its Reports.]
How do you relate to Segalstad's citing of many papers giving an average of 12 years or so for CO2 in the atmosphere? £/div>
[RSJ: By Segalstad, I presume you mean, "Carbon cycle modelling and the residence time of natural and anthropogenic atmospheric CO2: on the construction of the 'Greenhouse Effect Global Warming' dogma", 7/1/97. In that article, he provides a long table of multiple sources for residence time, and he concludes that they show the residence time to be "quite short, near 5 years." I wouldn't quibble with his data sources or even check is averaging. The IPCC formula yields about 2 years if leaf water is included, and 3.5 years otherwise. The formula is straight forward, and rather beyond question. It is analogous to the high school physics model for a leaky bucket.
[To get around its problem with the residence time, IPCC invents the concept of a "response time", which is longer apparently because of some time for its models to reach an equilibrium. Segalstad is correct that the long residence time is dogma. It is a necessary assumption, and at that not very successful, for the growth in atmospheric CO2 to have been caused by man. It is a failed link in the AGW conjecture.]
I would hope you know about the "atmospheric pipe" effect that explains why Lance Enderbee can show that 1ºC SST rise would cause 150 ppm increase, yet the solubility laws show there would be a total of 1000-1500Gt outgassing. This would be around 600 - 800 ppm increase - IF the CO2 hung around!
[RSJ: With some confidence, I'd say his last name is Endersbee. However, I could not find any reference associating him with an atmospheric pipe, or relating to numbers for outgassing as large as you suggest. The IPCC estimates the annual outgassing from the ocean to be about 90 Gt/year, so someone is suggesting a 10 to 15 fold increase. A 1% change in Henry's Constant at the high temperature end requires about a 17 degree change in temperature. Do you have a reference?
[In my model, the ocean exchange is dominated by absorption of CO2 across the surface, where currents carry the water poleward until they become loaded with CO2 in ice water. This model would not change much with changes in Sea Surface Temperature until the ice caps are gone. At the poles, the water descends into the THC (or MOC, to the IPCC), to reemerge mostly in the Eastern Equatorial Pacific to outgas at the prevailing temperature, where a one degree change would not have a huge impact. As a guess, could the model you suggest be computing outgassing over the entire ocean surface area?]
Posted by Lucy Skywalker | September 28, 2008 5:21 AM
I was a little surprised to see my name mentioned in this page, seems that my work on Vostok had some merit... And I have read your comments on my work about the increase of CO2 in the atmosphere in reply to David (August 24)...
[RSJ: Thanks for the comments. I sent you a heads-up by e-mail on 10/24/06. Perhaps the e-mail address was not correct. Your work on Vostok was instrumental in motivating me to apply systems science to the climate problem as created by IPCC. I found the curvature in your data to be significant and systemic.]
First, as is confusing amongst warmers as good [RSJ: well?] as skeptics, one needs to understand the difference between residence time of an individual CO2 molecule (A or n) in the atmosphere and the time that is necessary to remove an excess quantity of CO2 (as mass) over the natural temperature driven dynamic equilibrium between upper oceans / vegetation and atmosphere.
[RSJ: You seem to be distinguishing between Residence Time and Response Time, which IPCC defines in both its Third and Fourth Assessment Reports. Residence Time is the most elementary of physics from public school. On the other hand IPCC defines Response Time as a climate parameter, when it is actually a modeling parameter, set at the option of the modeler. About the best that could be said for Response Time is that it is unreliable, and in practice, subjective. Response Time is not suitable for an objective analysis.]
The residence time of an individual molecule is reigned by the turnover of about 150 GtC/yr between oceans/vegetation and atmosphere over the seasons (and partly continuous) on a total of ca. 800 GtC in the atmosphere. This gives a half life time of any CO2 molecule of slightly over 5 years. This is what is seen in the fate of aCO2 (as 13C decrease, less than expected from fossil fuel burning) and 14C from the atmospheric nuclear tests.
[RSJ: IPCC turnover is between 210 GtC/yr (TAR) and 214.8 (AR4). It might be 360 GtC/yr if leaf water replaces terrestrial Gross Primary Production, and 480 GtC/yr if it is in addition. IPCC just left leaf wa